Little help from the bands that are gigging

[RobTheDrummer]

I've played pretty much for nothing most of the time in PA. But it was for the enjoyment of playing. There were times in the band IN where I did a three nighter and ended the weekend with like 60 bux. I've opened a lot for nothing, did lots of free gigs.

You wanna make money? You gotta pay your dues like everyone else and their mother has mentioned, or you gotta move to a place that pays.

[drums=life]

I hear you rob, that is the honest facts. Got to pay your dues!!!

They really suck paying em but if you truely love to play, then its not a problem. I feel FedUP is worth more then we get, but that is how it goes brothers. get yourself some merch and shit to sell, that is how you make money and get your name out. We have been at it over a year with an all original approach, and we are starting to draw crowds and selling t shirts, stickers and CD's.

You gotta do what you gotta do

[VENTGtr]

Lisa,

See that'd'a been cool and greatly appreciated. That's the difference between a lot of places
that make it a pleasure to play and those that aren't so much.


I, too, have done a lot of free shows, openings, etc. and I think most bands have and understand it's part of the process. And, it's all done for the love of playing or you just
don't do it all that long and prolly aren't part of these discussion groups, at least not for
long.

That being said, the wisdom you gather from those things can be useful to others and mebbe help them out. Way back when, I/we had NO idea what we were doing and learned by
getting screwed over, screwing up, etc.

When my son gets into bands, if he so chooses, I'll offer whatever guidance I can knowing that no matter WHAT kind of advice I can give, there are still enough wrong
turns to make that he'll have some odd wrinkle to work through that I've never seen.

SO, I can impart what I know and be sure he'll pay his "dues" just like everyone else.

Time to make more coffee.


DaveP.

[MeYatch]

I feel FedUP is worth more then we get, but that is how it goes brothers.

Thats probably how it goes for a long long long time. If you are making more than what you are worth, that would be some crazy shit there.

the whole point:
what is a band of our stature worth to a bar?


thanks for your actual answer to the question paul, thats about the range we were thinking.

[songsmith]

At the other end of your career, I promise, the dues you paid will not be something you see as a price for being where you are, they will be the REWARD for being where you are. It's the journey, not the destination. You'll wear those dues like a crown, and refer to them as often as you would a college degree.
I absolutely guarantee you: you will pass on what you've learned as a working musician to your children and their children. You will also see and do things few other people ever do. Pay them dues!------>JMS

[RobTheDrummer]

You have a great point there Johnny! I'm only 24 man, I still got dues to pay and I feel fortunate to be in the situation that I'm in right now. Only took me 15 years of learning, only 7 of it playing in the "scene."

A few things I've learned about paying dues:

1.) Be patient. Good things rarely ever happen right away. You gotta play anywhere and everywhere for anything. Patience is the art of being cool during the times that will test your resolve.

2.) Take everything you can from a current or past gig. (I don't mean equipment!) I've learned so much from playing with everyone I've been fortunate enough to play with in my life. You can also learn a lot by watching other musicians. (thanks Bill!) Remember that each time you play with someone, you get a little more experience under your belt. Good or bad, take what you can from it.

3.) Get to know all the cats! One of the best things about being a musician is meeting other musicians. I'm good friends with a lot of you on here and I know I've talked or hung out with all of the great bands in the Central PA scene, as well as the Reno scene. Always respect one another and one another's ablilities. Support your scene!!!

Those are just a few of the things I have done to become successful at what I love. Just remember to be open minded and know that things will pay off in the end.

[DirtySanchez]

Honestly Meyatch, only you can answer the question of how much your band is worth monetarily, cuz some people will pay you a lot and some will pay you a little and some may even give you a good stiff ass-raping.
The only way you'll find out is to keep doing what you do and see what you get in return. We usually fare pretty well, and I'd imagine you guys will do even better because you have a bigger demographic to target.
But, starting out is definitely a bitch. Just make as many friends as you can and support ALL local music. Don't think that a band who doesn't make a ton of money is cutting anyones throat either cuz a bar owner would rather shell out the dough to pack the house. You guys have an awesome sound, and soon enough the word will spread. So do all you can to help it along and take advantage of all the "fringe" benefits.

[AtoMikEnRtiA]

benifts are one thing, all age shows are one thing (I'm not particularly into those anyway), opening slots for another band are one thing.

i hope like hell you're only doing this to enjoy yourself and for a hobby, because if you're looking to "make it in music" - the statement i quoted above, is the noose you used to commit career suicide with..

you can say what you want about all ages shows - you can say that the kids may not understand your music.. but if you're looking to go anywhere outside of tyrone with your music - you're gonna need those fucking kids you just pissed on.. you'll get nowhere above "regional hero" status doing bars and nothing but..

i also mean this with no disrespect intended to the bands that play bars and bars only - but you guys all know why you're in this, you have your reasons.. you're happy and i respect that..

[RobTheDrummer]

benifts are one thing, all age shows are one thing (I'm not particularly into those anyway), opening slots for another band are one thing.

i hope like hell you're only doing this to enjoy yourself and for a hobby, because if you're looking to "make it in music" - the statement i quoted above, is the noose you used to commit career suicide with..

you can say what you want about all ages shows - you can say that the kids may not understand your music.. but if you're looking to go anywhere outside of tyrone with your music - you're gonna need those fucking kids you just pissed on.. you'll get nowhere above "regional hero" status doing bars and nothing but..

i also mean this with no disrespect intended to the bands that play bars and bars only - but you guys all know why you're in this, you have your reasons.. you're happy and i respect that..

Whoa now! Just because he isn't particularly into all age shows, doesn't mean any ill hearted feelings towards them. I'm not particularly into them either, but I've played my share and had a killer time doing so. No need to be upset.

[DirtySanchez]

In all reality if I were in a cover band i wouldn't do all age shows.
The kids don't wanna hear it. That's why Fedup said fuck playing the Vacation Bible School Tour.

[AtoMikEnRtiA]

benifts are one thing, all age shows are one thing (I'm not particularly into those anyway), opening slots for another band are one thing.

i hope like hell you're only doing this to enjoy yourself and for a hobby, because if you're looking to "make it in music" - the statement i quoted above, is the noose you used to commit career suicide with..

you can say what you want about all ages shows - you can say that the kids may not understand your music.. but if you're looking to go anywhere outside of tyrone with your music - you're gonna need those fucking kids you just pissed on.. you'll get nowhere above "regional hero" status doing bars and nothing but..

i also mean this with no disrespect intended to the bands that play bars and bars only - but you guys all know why you're in this, you have your reasons.. you're happy and i respect that..

Whoa now! Just because he isn't particularly into all age shows, doesn't mean any ill hearted feelings towards them. I'm not particularly into them either, but I've played my share and had a killer time doing so. No need to be upset.

what man, lol ill hearted feelings? no lol - that may have seemed a bit aggressive but it wasnt, i swear lol (im on enough medication right now to be legally intoxicated in amsterdam, i couldnt possibly be pissed off)

[AtoMikEnRtiA]

In all reality if I were in a cover band i wouldn't do all age shows.
The kids don't wanna hear it. That's why Fedup said fuck playing the Vacation Bible School Tour.

this saddens me.. i seriously wanted to road along w/ you guys for this tour.. drinking the blood of christ for 3 months would have been a blast..

[RobTheDrummer]

Come on guys, keep this one on topic, good post!

[MeYatch]

dirty sanchez is right, the kids don't want to hear you playing cover tunes, especially not classic rock, which makes up probably at least half of our setlist.

I played my share of all age shows, and I went to my share of all age shows
...when I was younger.

Now the bar scene is more my thing. If I really wanted to "get the word out" about my music, of course I'd consider all age shows, but its hardly worth the time and energy to haul all our shit around and play the two originals we have written so far.

when the time comes that we've got a set of all originals, I'd look for echo chamber to play a few more all age events and benifits and the like, but for now, what I play appeals more to the bar crowd, so I'd prefer to concentrate the attack in that area.

[Griff]

Whats the going rate for a band that dosent completly suck? Gas and renting a trailer isnt getting any cheeper. How much is too much to ask for for a band that isnt well known?

Pay your dues as many said. I been on stage since age 15 played alot of music that wasnt my first pick but it was a buck now I am 36 I own my trailor and own my pa it takes time and I can say I been lucky over the years to keep playing and put cash back into it to keep upgrading when I dont have a band gig I do sound for other bands to generate a buck so that is nice to be able to jump on the production side of things to keep it going so its all about paying your dues good luck I payed dues and still pay dues

[brokenstrings]

One thing that kicks ass about this business is that if you buy quality gear it will last you years and years. Its just getting to the point when you have most of the things you want.

[Trucula]

One thing that kicks ass about this business is that if you buy quality gear it will last you years and years. Its just getting to the point when you have most of the things you want.

That would be great!...if they'd stop making new stuff Seems like you no sooner save up to buy that "Top-O-Line" item you wanted for along time and along comes something better!....You can bet as soon as the price drops to our range something just came out that beats that.

But I know where your coming from...If you buy quality,at least it becomes classic someday and might be sought by a collector.. case in point:..I bought a 4x4 remote truck w/ 4 wheeled steering..like 10-15 years ago...built it, never seem to get the bugs worked out and it sat on the shelf for years...then I put it on eBay and explained the whole deal and like 5 guys fought over it...ended up selling for 450 bucks...over 2 times what I paid...I asked the guy why he wanted it so bad and he said it was the 1st truck made by that company and he didnt care if it worked or not,it was going on a shelf to complete his collection.. ..(I Love eBay!!..where else could you get 700 people to look at something in 1 week )

[AtoMikEnRtiA]

where else could you get 700 people to look at something in 1 week )

i unzip my pants and you're all looking at something no matter where on earth you are..

[bassist_25]

You have a great point there Johnny! I'm only 24 man, I still got dues to pay and I feel fortunate to be in the situation that I'm in right now. Only took me 15 years of learning, only 7 of it playing in the "scene."

Yeah, and I've noticed a big increase in your maturity since you've started to play in Reno. It wasn't that you were immature before the move, but just from your posts on RP, you carry more of a "been there, done that" wisdom that you did not really have here back in PA.

Hope to see you at Burgi's tonight! It's been a while since we've jammed together.

im on enough medication right now to be legally intoxicated in amsterdam

LMFAO

One thing that kicks ass about this business is that if you buy quality gear it will last you years and years. Its just getting to the point when you have most of the things you want.

This may be diverging from the topic, but you, along with Griff mentioning upgrading, bring up good points. I've played with equipment that's been, well let's just say less than ideal. Many of the musicians I've played with on this board can attest to that. *LOL* But I always made it worked (it helps having good front of house support though when your rig isn't the best). I've come to the realization that if you want to have a professional sound, then you need professional-level equipment.

Now don't take that statement the wrong way. You won't find a bigger advocate of technique and musicianship than me. But all things equal, an accomplished guitarist will always sound better on a $3000 PRS than he would on a cheap $200 Samick Strat-knockoff. If you're gigging steady and making good money, then there is no excuse to be using junk.

That's not to say that things can't be a good value. I consider my Essex bass a good value. Schecters are excellent values. Some of Behringer equipment is surprisingly a good value, but a Behringer guitar cabinet cost $300 and a Mesa/Boogie Traditional costs $1000; and there's a world of difference on why there's such a difference in cost between those two cabinets.

[Trucula]

where else could you get 700 people to look at something in 1 week )

i unzip my pants and you're all looking at something no matter where on earth you are..

*1000 views and NO BIDS!*

Gary ,you do need laid Bro!
Get your hand off your "mouse"

[bassist_25]

That would be great!...if they'd stop making new stuff Seems like you no sooner save up to buy that "Top-O-Line" item you wanted for along time and along comes something better!....You can bet as soon as the price drops to our range something just came out that beats that.

LOL I hear that! I don't really look at basses anymore with intentions of buying. I've always known what bass I've wanted since I was 15 years old. When I finally got one last January, it was like settling down and getting married. There's really no reason to keep looking. That's not saying that I'll never buy another bass again, but it's not something that's high on my priority list.

Amps, on the other hand, are something that I almost have a fetish for, especially preamps. I wish that I could have a 12 space rack full of nothing but preamps with everything from an Alembic F1-X to an Eden Navigator to a Demeter VTBP-201S to a Phil Jones P-1 (btw, if anyone ever has one of the afermentioned Alembic pres for sale, get a hold of me). Maybe I'm drawn more to amps than basses/guitars because I've my technie nature.

[DirtySanchez]

Paul, sorry to hear that buying a new bass means less sex. (like settling down and getting married). Glad I'm not a bass player, I have enough problems

[Trucula]

That would be great!...if they'd stop making new stuff Seems like you no sooner save up to buy that "Top-O-Line" item you wanted for along time and along comes something better!....You can bet as soon as the price drops to our range something just came out that beats that.

Amps, on the other hand, are something that I almost have a fetish for, especially preamps.

When we opened for Warrant I was blown away by the Hughes and Kettner that Joey Allen used...The one with the clear plex-glass etched front....That thing was awesome!...I see why he carried it himself!!!..It glowed like blue...was nice just lookin at!

[BDR]

However, clubs would Rather Book a Sucky band than a Good Band cause of the price and it comes down to this How much do you want to play? so Good bands are having to drop there price considerably just to get a Gig or sit at home, SO it's a double edge blade

This simply isn't true. If you have the product, the résumé, the name recognition and the negotiation skills, you will get the money you deserve.

If you're having trouble finding venues that will pay you a fair rate, you need to either look in the mirror and figure out which of the four things on the above list you lack or quantify the venues you're targeting. Not every bar in the world will pay a fair rate. You have to shop venues as much as venues shop bands and decide which ones are worth your time.

We've dropped venues due to the "money ceiling" that exists. Let's face it, there are only a certain amount of days in a month and if you're "weekend warriors" trying to earn a supplemental living as we are in this stage of the game, you need to make decisions based on maximizing the money you can earn in those limited amount of days.

Basically, not every venue can be a good fit for every band.

PS. Hey Future Bobby and Co.: Take your gear discussion to Tech Sector where it belongs ... stay on topic, dammit ...

r:>)

[bassist_25]

PS. Hey Future Bobby and Co.: Take your gear discussion to Tech Sector where it belongs ... stay on topic, dammit ...

r:>)

You are now known as Robby "Lonewolf" Douchez. *LOL*