THE POLITICAL ARENA!!! Political Gladiators Inside!!

[onegunguitar]

http://news.yahoo.com/iran-says-buildin ... 44692.html

"Washington has asked for it back, a request Iran rejected."


LOL, I wonder if the Kenyan said pretty please?

Hahaha...no,he probably just put his tail between his legs and went home.

[f.sciarrillo]

http://news.yahoo.com/iran-says-buildin ... 44692.html

"Washington has asked for it back, a request Iran rejected."


LOL, I wonder if the Kenyan said pretty please?

Hahaha...no,he probably just put his tail between his legs and went home.

Would that be before or after he apologizes to them? I wouldn't worry about it much, the morons in Iran couldn't put a two peace puzzle together, let alone a U.S. Drone.

[Banned]

Government Motors announces it will employ thousands of Chinese citizens to build cars in China.

That really helps unemployed American citizens.

"General Motors Co. announced Monday at the Beijing auto show that it will begin building its all-new 2013 Cadillac XTS sedan in China this year and later will build the ELR luxury electric coupe in the country."

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2012 ... z1ss20FxEW


They should be built here and shipped there.

[onegunguitar]

Government Motors announces it will employ thousands of Chinese citizens to build cars in China.

That really helps unemployed American citizens.

"General Motors Co. announced Monday at the Beijing auto show that it will begin building its all-new 2013 Cadillac XTS sedan in China this year and later will build the ELR luxury electric coupe in the country."

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2012 ... z1ss20FxEW


They should be built here and shipped there.

That should be a well put together Caddy

[Hawk]

Government Motors announces it will employ thousands of Chinese citizens to build cars in China.

That really helps unemployed American citizens.

"General Motors Co. announced Monday at the Beijing auto show that it will begin building its all-new 2013 Cadillac XTS sedan in China this year and later will build the ELR luxury electric coupe in the country."

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2012 ... z1ss20FxEW


They should be built here and shipped there.

Really, you are complaining about capitalism and how it works ? I thought you were FOR unregulated capitalism ? Am I wrong, perhaps you're not given the fact that you are upset by it. What's up ?


This is one of many reasons the economy is great for the top % ! This is one of the reasons the people who rallied against Wall Street and the top 1%. Sounds like you guys are actually on our side. Feel free to explain why you're not.


ALL of you are for free enterprise ! Free and Pure Capitalism without any regulations ! This is what it brings. Why don't you get it ? When it works you complain ? Could you explain that top me ?

Personally I'd prefer some government regulations.

[Hawk]

Just wanted to point out that whitedevilone failed to present examples relative to his claims. Standard right wing procedure I guess.



RobTheDrummer wrote:
I remember the shit they were saying about bush, they didn't get arrested for that.


Hawk wrote:
You can't show me anywhere where a left winger made a threat to Bush and it wasn't denounced by all the left wing politicians and left wing media. Where as Nugent is beloved by the right for his outrageous statements.

whitedevilone wrote:
You are a funny and delusional little man Bill!!The left said the most vile awful things about W and his family. I never heard one outlet from the left defend him or denounce what their counterparts were saying.You are such a typical liberal.Do as i say.Not as i do.

Hawk wrote:
While I regularly listen to Limbaugh...Do you regularly watch MSNBC ? Have you heard the MSNBC evening/night time people destroy people like Wiener and Hillary Rose ? While the right is LOVING Nugent...
Where are your examples. Suffice it to say, name calling, really, you favor that route ?

[Hawk]

ONEGUNGUITAR, will you please provide a follow-up to your comments?

onegunguitar wrote:
What has Obama done for us in the last 3 1/2 years?

jetcity wrote:
what has he DONE to us that causes you to hate so much?

he's cleaning up BUSH'S f^king mess! that takes time, you dont turn a sinking ship overnight

onegunguitar wrote:
U.S. credit rating AAA downgrade, increase in national debt, unconstitutional healthcare bill,over regulations (which are killing business' in America),wants to end the coal industry and coal fired power plants,high unemployment rate,moratorium on Oil Drilling in the Gulf.....tell me,are you doing better today with $4.00 a gallon gas? It was what,$1.85 when Obama took office? Maybe you don't realize the high oil prices not only increase the cost of gas and fuel oil,it also raises the price of everything that is shipped by truck. He wants to raise taxes on the rich....who will pay that in the end? The middle class working Americans. Who do you think owns the places where people work? Sure as hell ain't the poor. Another term with the current President and we'll be a third world country. I hate to tell you but Obama don't give two shits about America and Americans...

Hawk wrote:
The downgrade came because a republican congress threatened to not raise the debt ceiling (that's against the law, the law says congress cannot renege on it's bills) and that threat that bills might not be paid caused ONE company to lower the rating - Republicans - Tea Party - fault ! Obviously your sources didn't report that.

Drilling for oil has increased and oil production has greatly increased under Obama compared to Bush. Or didn't you news sources report that ?Obviously you have been lied to when told that increased production would lower gas prices. Does that bother you that the right fooled you into believing that increased production would lower gas prices ? The refineries have simply INCREASED sales to foreign countries (of the refined products) with YOUR oil. Does that bother you ? AND they want to keep the subsidies we Americans GIVE them ? Record profits. They sell of OUR oil. WE subsidise THEM. And the right wants to keep it that way ? How about you, do you want to keep it that way, or would you side with Obama, who wants to STOP subsidising them.

In case you didn't know it, the rich and their top companies are enjoying a great economy. They are making a RECORD PROFITS ! Or didn't your news sources report that ? Did you know that ? Do you know they are hoarding trillions of dollars ? Or don't your news sources report that ? All I want is to back to Reagan era taxes. They (the rich) own most of the nation's wealth now. They can afford to pay better wages and STILL make record profits. They can afford to pay Reagan era taxes and STILL make record profits. They aren't doing shit for the middle class now, and they fooled the likes of some people that they need protection because they OWN everything ?LOL

I hate to tell you, but most of the top 5% don't give a shit about YOU (plural) !

Obama health care is basically what the Republicans (all the way back to Nixon) wanted. Didn't you news sources tell you that ? I suppose you prefer that health care is for the wealthy and screw anyone who can't afford it ? Yeah, that's a real American for you...

Considered yourself rebuttaled. (edit: corrected a typo)

You might think of getting you news from more than right wing sources, you're missing a lot.

AND THIS: _________________________________________


onegunguitar wrote:
Hawk...you keep believing Obama is doing a great job. IF he gets re-elected and the country goes to hell more than it already has,who you gonna blame then? God help this country if he gets another term.....he'll really put the screws to us.

Hawk wrote:
So typical of the right on here. NO rebuttal, no substance, just rhetoric, no surprise.

onegunguitar wrote:
I'm gonna be typical again..."whatever" Bill. You're typical of the left,what's the difference? You have your thoughts,I have mine. We'll never agree,so what. I'm just saying/asking who you gonna blame if he gets re-elected and shit gets worse? Gonna blame Bush again? I didn't know every post has to be up to your standards. I may not be the most "in tune" dude with politics,but what I do know is I served my country in the United States Marine Corps. and take great pride in saying that. The last thing I want to see is this great country fall because of Obama and his fucking lies and bull shit. You may worship the ground he walks on,I don't. I gave him the chance when he took office,he proved that he's not a leader. Think what ya what,copy paste what ya want...you won't change my mind about the way I feel about him or the left. Have a nice fucking day-somewhere else.

Hawk wrote:
I pointed out facts and showed where you were wrong. Yet you choose to ignore the facts in order to hang on to your "blame Obama" attitude regardless. Could you please explain why that is, as you ARE typical of the right wing.

The economy IS GREAT if you are the top %. They are making record profits. RECORD PROFITS ! If THEY paid a decent wage the economy for the rest of us would / could be great too. How is that Obama's fault ? You blamed Obama for gas prices and I pointed out that oil production is increased (higher than the Bush era) yet refineries simply sell of the excess to foreign countries. Obama has NO control over that. So exactly what is it that you see that Obama has failed ?

[Hawk]

FRANK, will you be able to answer this post ?

Frank wrote:
Depression?

We have a higher unemployment rate than when Bush was in office.
We are further in debt than when Bush was in office.
We have double the gas prices than when BUsh was in office.
We have a higher number of people on foodstamps than when Bush was in office.
We have a higher number of people on welfare than when Bush was in office.

Yeah, depression my ass. It is worse now than it was when Bush was in office. If anything, this is Obama's depression. He only made things worse. Then since he is liberal, all you other libs say the economy is booming. If there was a republican President in there right now, you would be saying completely the opposite of what you say now.

Recent polls:

-> 84% of Americans say they are no better off than they were for years ago.
-> 61% say the country is going in the wrong direction.

Hawk wrote:
Frank, Again, the economy is GREAT if you're in the top % ! remember ? They are making RECORD PROFITS. Again, is they paid decent wages and created jobs (we've been told that is what they would do if we gave them tax breaks !) the economy would be repaired. How is that Obama's fault that the top % are so un-American ?

How much of the increase in debt is Obama paying of Bush's bills ? Wars, tax cuts to the rich, deals with the drug companies etc. etc. etc..

There, that answers your first three "faults" with facts.

And yet again, oil production has INCREASED under Obama, the refineries set the price. The refineries are selling record amounts to foreign countries. Just more FACTS that don't get reported by the right wing media.

Why is any of that Obama's fault ?

So yes again Frank. Bush left office with the economy in a near depression. How long would you give one man to get us out of a near depression ?
Why is it that you are so good a rhetoric yet you regurlalry avoid simple questions that require you to think on your own ?

[Banned]

"George Zimmerman, the accused murderer of Florida teen Trayvon Martin, has been released from jail on bail. Meeting Zimmerman's release are calls (on Twitter) for him to be killed. As Twitchy reports, "Twitter lynch mob: George Zimmerman is out on bail? Let’s kill him!"

But it's not just Zimmerman who is at risk. In fact, there's already been a call on Twitter for the murder of the judge, Circuit Judge Kenneth Lester, who agreed to release Zimmerman on bail.

Writing on a Twitter, someone named @Rick_Cobain writes, "Zimmerman released from jail someone kill the judge!!!!!"

Zimmerman released from jail someone kill the judge!!!!!

—  (@Rick_Cobain) April 23, 2012

Already 25 other people have retweeted @Rick_Cobain's call for murder."

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/som ... 40598.html

Aren't liberals sweet?

[lonewolf]

And yet again, oil production has INCREASED under Obama, the refineries set the price. The refineries are selling record amounts to foreign countries. Just more FACTS that don't get reported by the right wing media.

Actually, the rise in oil production is completely due to private and state concerns that Obama had nothing to do with. Oil production under federal control has actually declined since Obama took office due to his gulf moratorium. The increased production is mostly attributable to actions that were taken about 10 years ago...remember 10 years ago when you guys were all saying that increased production wouldn't work because it would take 10 years? Well its been 10 years! ROFLMAO!

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/thepresid ... n-Hike.htm

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/oil-pro ... ama-s-term

Also, your other FACTS are incorrect. The refineries don't set the price for oil...that is done at the commodities exchanges.

Refineries selling record amounts of oil to foreign countries? Since when do refineries sell oil? Duh! Refineries BUY oil as their raw material. They sell gasoline and other petroleum distillates--for a very modest single-digit profit-margin.

That's OK, the media has convinced the oblivious non-investor public that the US is exporting half its oil. *buzzer* WRONG! We are still importing a little less than half the crude oil that we use. What the media is making murky is that roughly half the gasoline produced in the US is exported now. This little phenomenon came about because of the slower demand for gasoline in the US caused by higher prices and a poor economy...AND, as China industrializes, their demand for gasoline is going up, up, up. May as well sell it to them for top dollar and bring some dollars back home.

19th and 20th century ideas don't work in the 21st century.

[lonewolf]

How much of the increase in debt is Obama paying of Bush's bills ? Wars, tax cuts to the rich, deals with the drug companies etc. etc. etc..

I would estimate about 10-15% of the current annual deficit. The rest is attributable to new programs implemented by the democrat super-majority and lower-than-expected revenues because the economy has not rebounded.

These numbers are murky because the President has not signed a budget into law since he took office.

[lonewolf]

Obama is the lowest of the low. Not worthy of the heel of my boot:

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/op ... LJY7JzXEIJ

[Blue Reality]

Hey he should present the details of this bait and switch prior to the election. Transparent administration you know. Open and honest.

[whitedevilone]

[quote="Hawk"]Just wanted to point out that whitedevilone failed to present examples relative to his claims. Standard right wing procedure I


Hawk wrote:
You can't show me anywhere where a left winger made a threat to Bush and it wasn't denounced by all the left wing politicians and left wing media. Where as Nugent is beloved by the right for his outrageous statements.

whitedevilone wrote:
You are a funny and delusional little man Bill!!The left said the most vile awful things about W and his family. I never heard one outlet from the left defend him or denounce what their counterparts were saying.You are such a typical liberal.Do as i say.Not as i do.

Bill, i did not respond to you, because as per usual, you're ridiculous.Do i have times,dates,stations,anchor people and quotes of the terrible things that the left said about W and his family?I do not.I do however remember being alive for the last 3years of the man's administration.You were alive right Bill?You weren't brain dead right Bill?You can't recall ever hearing Oberman,Madeow,Shultz,Mathews,Time,Newsweek,RollingStone,NYTimes,Huffington post,LA Times,ABC,NBC,CBS,MSNBC,CNN,HOLLYWOOD and the f$#king list goes on and on saying awful things about the man and his family?.You never heard a bad word or motive uttered from these folks huh Bill?That, my fine feathered friend is why i don't respond to you.You claim to hear both sides of the story but you really only suckle on one teet.

[Hawk]

And yet again, oil production has INCREASED under Obama, the refineries set the price. The refineries are selling record amounts to foreign countries. Just more FACTS that don't get reported by the right wing media.

Actually, the rise in oil production is completely due to private and state concerns that Obama had nothing to do with. Oil production under federal control has actually declined since Obama took office due to his gulf moratorium. The increased production is mostly attributable to actions that were taken about 10 years ago...remember 10 years ago when you guys were all saying that increased production wouldn't work because it would take 10 years? Well its been 10 years! ROFLMAO!

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/thepresid ... n-Hike.htm




http://cnsnews.com/news/article/oil-pro ... ama-s-term

Also, your other FACTS are incorrect. The refineries don't set the price for oil...that is done at the commodities exchanges.

Refineries selling record amounts of oil to foreign countries? Since when do refineries sell oil? Duh! Refineries BUY oil as their raw material. They sell gasoline and other petroleum distillates--for a very modest single-digit profit-margin.

That's OK, the media has convinced the oblivious non-investor public that the US is exporting half its oil. *buzzer* WRONG! We are still importing a little less than half the crude oil that we use. What the media is making murky is that roughly half the gasoline produced in the US is exported now. This little phenomenon came about because of the slower demand for gasoline in the US caused by higher prices and a poor economy...AND, as China industrializes, their demand for gasoline is going up, up, up. May as well sell it to them for top dollar and bring some dollars back home.

19th and 20th century ideas don't work in the 21st century.

Come on Jeff. The refineries (as I've pointed out more than once) are selling record amounts of REFINED products, like gas, jet fuel etc.. They use oil , including our oil.

Drilling for oil is UP under Obama too.

[Hawk]

Just wanted to point out that whitedevilone failed to present examples relative to his claims. Standard right wing procedure I


Hawk wrote:
You can't show me anywhere where a left winger made a threat to Bush and it wasn't denounced by all the left wing politicians and left wing media. Where as Nugent is beloved by the right for his outrageous statements.

whitedevilone wrote:
You are a funny and delusional little man Bill!!The left said the most vile awful things about W and his family. I never heard one outlet from the left defend him or denounce what their counterparts were saying.You are such a typical liberal.Do as i say.Not as i do.

Bill, i did not respond to you, because as per usual, you're ridiculous.Do i have times,dates,stations,anchor people and quotes of the terrible things that the left said about W and his family?I do not.I do however remember being alive for the last 3years of the man's administration.You were alive right Bill?You weren't brain dead right Bill?You can't recall ever hearing Oberman,Madeow,Shultz,Mathews,Time,Newsweek,RollingStone,NYTimes,Huffington post,LA Times,ABC,NBC,CBS,MSNBC,CNN,HOLLYWOOD and the f$#king list goes on and on saying awful things about the man and his family?.You never heard a bad word or motive uttered from these folks huh Bill?That, my fine feathered friend is why i don't respond to you.You claim to hear both sides of the story but you really only suckle on one teet.

SO MANY vile things were said (acording to you), with support from the left wing media, and you don't remember any of them and you ask if I was alive ? LOL. I guess if you fill your post full of insults it make you feel good about your post...

Threats to (or imply to ) kill...No I didn't hear anything like that. Nothing like Nugent. With the left wing media supporting a person like that ? You never heard anything like that either.

Typical from the right to make things up and provide insults rather than back up what they say...

The saddest thing is that you named all the media that you don't watch yet you know its bad because you've been told it's bad. Think about that.

[lonewolf]

Come on Jeff. The refineries (as I've pointed out more than once) are selling record amounts of REFINED products, like gas, jet fuel etc.. They use oil , including our oil.

Drilling for oil is UP under Obama too.

You wrote about OIL, not refined products--its right there for all to see--I only see a reference to OIL and no reference to refined products. I already explained which production (drilling is part of production) was up under Obama. It is DESPITE his policies, not due to them.

[Hawk]

Come on Jeff. The refineries (as I've pointed out more than once) are selling record amounts of REFINED products, like gas, jet fuel etc.. They use oil , including our oil.

Drilling for oil is UP under Obama too.

You wrote about OIL, not refined products--its right there for all to see--I only see a reference to OIL and no reference to refined products. I already explained which production (drilling is part of production) was up under Obama. It is DESPITE his policies, not due to them.

I've said it so many times in this thread that I'm tired of saying it. Refined products. I don't give a damn if oil production is up because of Obama or not. These right wingers don't even know it's up because Fox won't tell them.

Given your intelligence, I'm guessing you knew they were selling refined products as well as I did.

And my whole point is (which you'd rather avoid while picking apart less important things) that gas prices did not come down when oil production increased. As we were told it would since "drill baby drill". My point is that our oil is not our oil. It is the refineries oil. And they sell to a world market (refined products Jeff).

[lonewolf]

Given your intelligence, I'm guessing you knew they were selling refined products as well as I did.

And my whole point is (which you'd rather avoid while picking apart less important things) that gas prices did not come down when oil production increased. As we were told it would since "drill baby drill". My point is that our oil is not our oil. It is the refineries oil. And they sell to a world market (refined products Jeff).

If you do not say what you mean, how can I possibly know what you mean?

Had we not increased oil production, the oil supply would be much tighter than it is, resulting in even higher oil prices...if you subscribe to the law of supply and demand. I submit that gas prices would be climbing much higher, much faster without the increased oil production.

Of course, the complete and utter non-existance of a recovery from the recession is also helping to curb demand. Things would be much different if we had a recovery like in 1983-84 when we came out of the true worst recession since the great depression. Oil would be tight and we'd be paying $5+ at the pump.

Perhaps Obama's poor economic policies are designed to keep oil from going even higher than it is now? Who knows what that scheming bastard is up to?

Well, I guess he's not quite a bastard, but close.

[whitedevilone]

Just wanted to point out that whitedevilone failed to present examples relative to his claims. Standard right wing procedure I


Hawk wrote:
You can't show me anywhere where a left winger made a threat to Bush and it wasn't denounced by all the left wing politicians and left wing media. Where as Nugent is beloved by the right for his outrageous statements.

whitedevilone wrote:
You are a funny and delusional little man Bill!!The left said the most vile awful things about W and his family. I never heard one outlet from the left defend him or denounce what their counterparts were saying.You are such a typical liberal.Do as i say.Not as i do.

Bill, i did not respond to you, because as per usual, you're ridiculous.Do i have times,dates,stations,anchor people and quotes of the terrible things that the left said about W and his family?I do not.I do however remember being alive for the last 3years of the man's administration.You were alive right Bill?You weren't brain dead right Bill?You can't recall ever hearing Oberman,Madeow,Shultz,Mathews,Time,Newsweek,RollingStone,NYTimes,Huffington post,LA Times,ABC,NBC,CBS,MSNBC,CNN,HOLLYWOOD and the f$#king list goes on and on saying awful things about the man and his family?.You never heard a bad word or motive uttered from these folks huh Bill?That, my fine feathered friend is why i don't respond to you.You claim to hear both sides of the story but you really only suckle on one teet.

SO MANY vile things were said (acording to you), with support from the left wing media, and you don't remember any of them and you ask if I was alive ? LOL. I guess if you fill your post full of insults it make you feel good about your post...

Threats to (or imply to ) kill...No I didn't hear anything like that. Nothing like Nugent. With the left wing media supporting a person like that ? You never heard anything like that either.

Typical from the right to make things up and provide insults rather than back up what they say...

The saddest thing is that you named all the media that you don't watch yet you know its bad because you've been told it's bad. Think about that.

How do you know what i watch Bill?Do we live together Bill?I keep tabs on all sides Bill.You may not believe that but i do Bill.Have i insulted you Bill?Where?AND you keep saying over and over that Nuge threatened your boy's life.He did nothing of the sort.Once again it's ok for BILL to twist people's words to fit his agenda,but good lord if you can't paste and copy all fact,dates,times and places Bill just roll his eyes and lump you with the dreaded "right".I guess i did call you ridiculous didn't i.

[f.sciarrillo]

Typical liberals never hear the bad things said from their own side. They only hear bad things from the other. Most liberals who claim to listen to both sides is lying. Everyone knows they may hear things from both sides, but they only listen to one side; the side they agree with.

I DO Listen to both sides, and I don't remember hearing the left make death threats to Bush. I do, however, remember how rude and disrespectful they were too him. They did say some pretty nasty things about him. I also, do, remember a movie that was made about assassinating Bush -> Death of a President (2006 film) | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_a ... 06_film%29 |. The only person on the left who denounced it was Hillary Clinton, there wasn't a peep out of anyone else. Then it was something they agreed with, so they let it go. If the right would do a movie like that about the liberals dream Obama, there would be outrage in the streets with riots and destruction. Typical the liberals don't recall the movie.

As for oil. It is up alright, on private land. Not on the federal land. There is a moratorium in the gulf, west coast and east coast. The up tick in drilling has nothing to do with Obama. I don't believe it is up enough to make a difference. Then if it was up a half of a percent, the liberals would be saying that it is up by a lot.

No, Bill, I didn't get this information from Fox News. I haven't watched a news station in a couple of weeks because I am sick of hearing the same thing over and over again. I am also sick of listening to the bias bs that comes out of them, and them only reporting what they want people to hear. Of course I will be watching CNN a little tonight to see the election results.

edit: Let me point out that I don't remember hearing the media make death threats to Bush. of course it was different during rallies, like the pics below.

[lonewolf]

Hmmm, no death threats for Dubya?

(see pics on Frank's reply, below--I deleted them for clarity)

[f.sciarrillo]

Hmmm, no death threats for Dubya?

When I said about the left not calling for the death of Bush, I meant the media. Not the idiots from the rallies that people had.

[lonewolf]

Hmmm, no death threats for Dubya?

When I said about the left not calling for the death of Bush, I meant the media. Not the idiots from the rallies that people had.

OK, fair enough...did somebody in the media threaten Obama that I didn't hear about?

If you are talking about Nugent, well, there are similar celebrity gaffes that are actually more pointed...even from his 2004 opponent, John Kerry:

From Bill Maher's Real Time:

Maher : You could have went to New Hampshire and killed two birds with one stone.

Kerry : Or, I could have gone to 1600 Pennsylvania and killed the real bird with one stone.

Or how about this Nobel Peace Prize winner, Betty Williams:

“I mean right now, I could kill George Bush , no problem. No, I don’t mean that. I mean — how could you nonviolently kill somebody? I would love to be able to do that.”

What a fucking douche nozzle she is!

Anyway...as with all things...BOTH SIDES ARE GUILTY!

[f.sciarrillo]

You know, looking at those pictures brought back some memories. The main one was how the left was making comments about the tea party. It looks more like their comments should have been directed at their own party rallies. Wow, you talk about some ignorant people. It makes your head spin to see the hypocrisy from the left.