THE POLITICAL ARENA!!! Political Gladiators Inside!!

[Merge]

I'm still trying to figure out why it's suddenly bad for a person to make money. I hoard money every paycheck, and I'll continue to do so. If a person makes $25 million a year, and is paying taxes at a rate set by the Govt, it seems the Govt would be the entity to blame. They set the rules, then get mad when someone uses these rules to get ahead. I can't quite figure out why it's bad that these corporations have money in their accounts. As far as job creation, I still believe that you can't "create" a job. They're not going to hire someone simply because someone says that they need to create jobs. 7-11 isn't going to hire a cashier unless they need one, and if they have enough people working at a particular store, they're not going to hire more just for the hell of it. I'm just stating my opinion, and this is not meant to start an argument that quickly deteriorates into name calling, like every other post on here. All of you have your beliefs, I have mine.

[lonewolf]

If people spend the money they make in the consumer market, on things they need to survive, it goes to business, including small business. I believe that's called economically feasible.

So you are saying that taking a dollar out of the economy and putting 80 cents back in is a positive contribution?

They teach you that in Vo-Tech Johnny?

I can't say with any authority that there's 20% overhead, can you?.

Since the government doesn't pay any attention to overhead like a business would, they don't give the taxpayer a decipherable balance sheet. I think this is on purpose; however, non-defense discretionary expenses for the cabinet departments makes up 19% of the budget. Interest on the debt makes up 5% of the budget.

There's 24%. Defense overhead is very murky, but I'm already to 24% so it doesn't matter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Us_federal ... categories

follow the notes if you can.

BTW, although I have two engineering degrees from Penn State, if I took two more math courses, i could also have a BS in Mathematics. Another course in education and I would be qualified to TEACH math at Hollidayburg High School. I already have an open offer to TEACH senior level engineering courses at Penn State. This requires advanced differential calculus.

In case you didn't know, thats all those squiggles on the chalkboards that you have seen in SciFi movies.

[songsmith]

Stumpy, you aught to let your Kenyan use this one, who knows, the sheeple might buy it.

Oh! What rapier wit! Oh, how you showed me! Whatever can I do, I've been bested by an intellectual giant!

Debt creates capital. Your mortgage-holder holds your debt, and you pay ALL of the debt, plus HUGE amounts of interest. Interest IS capital, moron. Debt creates capital for the debtholder, which in this case, is mostly us. Moron.

So, when you want to start a business and go to buy a building, you better have some capital. Just tell the owner that you have a lot of debt, and that debt is capital. He will just give you the keys without any questions.

Yes, that debt generates capital... for the bank that holds the debt. They will generate maybe three times their initial investment: capital. You're looking at it from the debtor's point of view, but according to Krugman in the article the grown-ups were discussing, we are also the debtholder. In your little story where you buy the building, you own the bank that you owe the debt to. Of course, that ruins the whole point of the story. What was that?

[Banned]

Can someone buy a guitar at the store where you work with their debt? You say that will be $500, lets say. They say they have no money but a lot of debt, and they read on rockpage that debt is capital. You will just give him the guitar????

[whitedevilone]

I'm still trying to figure out why it's suddenly bad for a person to make money. I hoard money every paycheck, and I'll continue to do so. If a person makes $25 million a year, and is paying taxes at a rate set by the Govt, it seems the Govt would be the entity to blame. They set the rules, then get mad when someone uses these rules to get ahead. I can't quite figure out why it's bad that these corporations have money in their accounts. As far as job creation, I still believe that you can't "create" a job. They're not going to hire someone simply because someone says that they need to create jobs. 7-11 isn't going to hire a cashier unless they need one, and if they have enough people working at a particular store, they're not going to hire more just for the hell of it. I'm just stating my opinion, and this is not meant to start an argument that quickly deteriorates into name calling, like every other post on here. All of you have your beliefs, I have mine.

This.

[songsmith]

Can someone buy a guitar at the store where you work with their debt? You say that will be $500, lets say. They say they have no money but a lot of debt, and they read on rockpage that debt is capital. You will just give him the guitar????

Trying to reduce it to an absurd argument, that's super-cute, joe. It's obviously zooming past you.

If someone owned the guitar buyer's debt, they would expect to receive interest on that debt. If you are the guitar-buyer, the person who's making interest from your debt could buy that guitar. Interest is capital. Slowly: Interest... is... capital. Your debt created capital. Not "your debt is capital," your debt creates capital, it is the very basis of capitalism itself.
Now let's continue your guitar purchase...
You: "I want to buy this guitar. I don't have enough cash, but I have a plastic card that represents the ability to incur a debt. I not only pay interest on that debt, but some crazy fees, as well."
Me: I will use the plastic card to signify that you have incurred the debt. The people who assumed that debt will ask for more money from you than the cost of the guitar. That is capitalism, which you seem to revere above all else."
You: "Shut up, you are a Marxist Kenyan Fuhrer."
Me: "So, how's the band?"
Then the bank made money. As referenced in the big-people srticle, we own the bank.

[songsmith]

The American Dream vs. Class Warfare. MSN/New York Times.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/45883052/ns ... ork_times/

[Banned]

The country is over 15 $TRILLION in debt. That is now a good thing, debt is capital. The country is in great shape. The Kenyan must be the greatest president because he created more debt in three years than any other. Spin is a great thing when he has to run on the worst economy since the Great Depression.

[songsmith]

Who owns the debt, dum-dum?

[songsmith]

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arc ... ng/242484/

http://www.businessinsider.com/who-owns-us-debt-2011-7

http://www.washingtonpost.com/r/2010-20 ... Debt17.pdf

[Banned]

Who owns the debt, dum-dum?

Its who pays the debt that really matters, ass wipe.

[songsmith]

Really, joey? Take a dollar-bill out of your left pocket. Now give it to yourself (don't worry, it's just a loan). Now you owe yourself a dollar.
Okay, put the dollar in your right pocket. You just paid yourself, aren't you lucky?!
Understand yet?
I didn't think so.

[Banned]

There is no understanding the insanity that pours out of that pea brain.

Your Kenyan has led this country to more federal debt than the gross domestic product. There are countries in Europe in the same mess who are getting bailed out. Only an idiot would see that as a good thing.

[lonewolf]

Who owns the debt?

The debtor is the US Federal Government.

The list of creditors is quite lengthy and includes individuals and entities both foreign and domestic as well as foreign governments.

The last time I looked, the two largest creditors were the Social Security Trust Fund and the Federal Reserve bank. Although they are affiliated with the government, neither is a direct component of the US government, nor do they appear on the federal budget. They are treated as separate entities. To say that "we owe ourselves" is a complete falsehood and would result in utter financial ruin if the public was to actually believe that bullshit and allow borrowing to continue from these levels.

Any default by the US government on its debt obligations due to insolvency could likely result in financial chaos the world has not seen since the fall of Rome. Our advanced technology will not prevent it...on the contrary, it will probably accelerate it.

[hannible]

Thank god we have Obama and the Democrats...after the Republicans put us in this mess...Johnny, your foes will not say who they are for as President....they wine and call Obama names like they always do...but they have no one to root for, cause the Republican field is full of waco loosers...

[lonewolf]

Thank god we have Obama and the Democrats...after the Republicans put us in this mess...Johnny, your foes will not say who they are for as President....they wine and call Obama names like they always do...but they have no one to root for, cause the Republican field is full of waco loosers...

Every administration and congress since 1933 has put us in this mess. Ever since FDR's New Deal, this was the inevitable, logical result. It just took this long to play itself out.

When parts of the Constitution were usurped, it rendered the rest of the document ineffective. The concept of checks and balances was not conceived just to protect us from single-party rule, but to protect us from government itself. Today, there is only the thinnest veil of checks & balances. I predict that in the coming years a major crisis will tear that veil away and reveal the true nature of the beast within.

There is a certain irony with today's partisan rantings. When the major parties and their blind supporters talk about themselves, they couldn't be further from the truth. By the same token, most of what they say about each other is compellingly accurate.

[songsmith]

There is no understanding the insanity that pours out of that pea brain.
.

Well, there's no understanding from YOU, it's well over your head. If Rush hasn't drilled it into you with a catch-phrase every few minutes for a month, you can't understand it. I'd be really careful about using the word, "insanity," if I were you, for reasons that are obvious to everyone but you.

[songsmith]

.[/quote] Every administration and congress since 1933 has put us in this mess. Ever since FDR's New Deal, this was the inevitable, logical result. It just took this long to play itself out..[/quote]

I wondered how long it would take to get a talkshow-inspired indictment of FDR. Yes, Jeff, I'm sure it was a bad thing to feed old people and kids, and millions of young men sitting idle is not dangerous at all. Letting the robber barons have free reign over us did not end the Depression, it CAUSED it.


.[/quote]There is a certain irony with today's partisan rantings. When the major parties and their blind supporters talk about themselves, they couldn't be further from the truth. By the same token, most of what they say about each other is compellingly accurate.[/quote]

Really? Where are the high taxes? Where are the death squads? Where's the follow-up to 9/11, the Sharia Law, the conservative interrment camps, the high interest rates? Where are the government takeover and socialization of healthcare? Where's the Godless Pledge Of Allegiance, the race war, the crash of the stock market? What happened more bank bailouts, the Beck-pocalypse, taking our guns, outlawing Christmas, staying in Iraq and Afghanistan indefinitely, and having to learn Chinese or Arabic? Was Sarah Palin the salvation of American politics? Is Rupert Murdoch the shining example of responsible journalism?
No, buddy. Using "compellingly accurate" as a description of right-wing attack-politics is "astoundingly inaccurate."

[Banned]

There is no understanding the insanity that pours out of that pea brain.
.

Well, there's no understanding from YOU, it's well over your head. If Rush hasn't drilled it into you with a catch-phrase every few minutes for a month, you can't understand it. I'd be really careful about using the word, "insanity," if I were you, for reasons that are obvious to everyone but you.

Can't you do better than a "No I'm not, you are...." post? Obviously no.

[shredder138]

There is no understanding the insanity that pours out of that pea brain.
.

Well, there's no understanding from YOU, it's well over your head. If Rush hasn't drilled it into you with a catch-phrase every few minutes for a month, you can't understand it. I'd be really careful about using the word, "insanity," if I were you, for reasons that are obvious to everyone but you.

Can't you do better than a "No I'm not, you are...." post? Obviously no.

Your posts have about as much substance as frank's.

[Banned]

We are still waiting for some sort of political substance in a post of yours. This is the political thread, but all you do is make personal attacks. Sprinkle in a original thought if you are able to. Scared?

[shredder138]

We are still waiting for some sort of political substance in a post of yours. This is the political thread, but all you do is make personal attacks. Sprinkle in a original thought if you are able to. Scared?

Fuck you , you piece of shit I'll kick your ass next time I see you , Loser!

That's a proper personal attact, asswipe, now quit pretending you're offering political substance in yer posts.

[lonewolf]

Every administration and congress since 1933 has put us in this mess. Ever since FDR's New Deal, this was the inevitable, logical result. It just took this long to play itself out..

I wondered how long it would take to get a talkshow-inspired indictment of FDR. Yes, Jeff, I'm sure it was a bad thing to feed old people and kids, and millions of young men sitting idle is not dangerous at all. Letting the robber barons have free reign over us did not end the Depression, it CAUSED it.


There is a certain irony with today's partisan rantings. When the major parties and their blind supporters talk about themselves, they couldn't be further from the truth. By the same token, most of what they say about each other is compellingly accurate.

Really? Where are the high taxes? Where are the death squads? Where's the follow-up to 9/11, the Sharia Law, the conservative interrment camps, the high interest rates? Where are the government takeover and socialization of healthcare? Where's the Godless Pledge Of Allegiance, the race war, the crash of the stock market? What happened more bank bailouts, the Beck-pocalypse, taking our guns, outlawing Christmas, staying in Iraq and Afghanistan indefinitely, and having to learn Chinese or Arabic? Was Sarah Palin the salvation of American politics? Is Rupert Murdoch the shining example of responsible journalism?
No, buddy. Using "compellingly accurate" as a description of right-wing attack-politics is "astoundingly inaccurate."

There is a certain irony with today's partisan rantings. When the major parties and their blind supporters talk about themselves, they couldn't be further from the truth. By the same token, most of what they say about each other is compellingly accurate.

Translated: Liberal progressive shit stinks just as bad as neo-conservative shit.

Also, I have decided that you rant too much and you may only have one free question at a time. I accept Paypal.

[songsmith]

Also, I have decided that you rant too much and you may only have one free question at a time. I accept Paypal.

Between you and joe, you have answered zero questions. Is this because you're conservative, and can't respond with any sort of viable rebuttal in kind; or because you're conservative, and don't see those kinds of nutzoid rhetoric as wrong?

[songsmith]

Can't you do better than a "No I'm not, you are...." post? Obviously no.

And you got, "No, I'm not, you are..." from what part of my answer to you? I explained it over and over, and ZOOM!!... right past you. What do you want me to say, you're right? YOU'RE WRONG.
I even posted some links to back up my point, did you check them? Nooooo! How dare Johnny make a point that doesn't jive with Tea Party doctrine! Jesus, no wonder you're so frustrated, as much time as you spend bent over a political stump.
How many times do I have to tell you, if you can't hang with the grown-ups, go away.