the new GnR cd

[JayBird]

From all the reports that I've heard...Buckethead is no longer in the band. As a matter of fact, many of the musicians who recorded on the album either left during the recording process or left in the tour planning process. All former members state that Axl is mentally insane and so full of himself that is was too much to take.

[VENTGtr]

regards to waiting, I can't say that I believe anyone
really "waited" for this. They were just sort of still alive when it came out.

All former members state that Axl is mentally insane and so
full of himself that is was too much to take.

Ya, when a guy who calls himself "Buckethead" and wears a Micheal Myers
mask paired with fast food "attire" says yer nuts...well...there might be some
issues...

[Ronnyd]

Politics aside,I love this new disk.
Better then The new Mettalica,And the new AC/DC.
Why ???It 's great on headphones,and doesn't sound like everything else I'Ve ever heard. Fire Away!

[metalchurch]

I got my coupon from Dr.Pepper today. Good for a free Dr.Pepper up to $1.50.
I'll drink it slow Axl, and I'll "Think about you"

[VENTGtr]

Why ???It 's great on headphones,and doesn't sound like everything else I'Ve ever heard. Fire Away!

No firing. Cool you found something you like. Seems harder to do nowadays, least for
me (My most recent downloads? A ton of T-Rex that I only had on cassette...somewhere).

As for the headphones, maybe it's just that I don't listen to much now, but there used to
be some cool mixes of which you really only got the full extent on headphones. Though
not a favourite to many people, if you ever get to hear the DLR album "Skyscraper" on
phones, there's some great stuff on there. Vai had a lot, if not everything, to do with that.

I was on a bus coming back from Pittsburgh about a week after it came out, listening and
thinking it was the coolest thing ever.

[Redsfury]

"because honestly, i refuse to pay for it. it's been to long in the making and i'll be damned if i'll help axl pay that 3 million dollar production cost"-slackin bass..... hmmm when i bought my album i wasnt charged 3 mill, actually it was 13.99 in state. metallicas new album lists on walmart.com for 18.00 but wait, wasnt it a lot less to produce?ah yes turning a profit is better than paying the bills... haha just pickin
I loved the album, i have the cd and on vinyl, it never leaves my cd player but i will agree with rfbuck that some songs are melodramatic textbook axl. but that reputation has been with him through all the albums. that aspect hasnt changed. he did retain dizzy reed on keyboards from the use your illusion era which i think was a great choice. his piano riffs ring reminiscent of november rain, and the last half hour of civil war, but not enough to sound recycled. couple that with the effective "in the pocket" grooves of brain (drums) and the slew of other people who had a hand in this album, and it creates a sound that if, only for several notes at a time snaps you back to a time when "civil war", "paradice city" and "november rain" fought fiercely with nirvana, pearl jam, and soundgarden for time on the radiowaves of the 90s. i think alot of unnescesary criticism comes from the fact theyre stilled billed as GNR. i think its unfair to berate the musicians who got with axl and put up with him to turn out some of the most unique, catchiest, vaguely familiar songs to break out of the "cookie cutter mold" rock scene in quite a good while. dont get me wrong, i love anything off of "appetite", but its 2008, things change. if you want the same chords and song structure as in 85 i hear ACDC just released a new album. if youre judging this album off of its title track....stop it... bad.... no! in my opinion its the worst song on the album. next time you hear a song off this album pretend its not GNR. if it was some no name band (if you need a name we`ll say "quagnum") with average production costs, and no axl, would it still draw the same criticism? or would it be easier to hear the groove of a bunch of people who just wanted to make some music?
this is just my opinion i didnt mean to offend or attack anyone, in fact, im the guy that lent slackin@dabass my copy of this album
thanks-red

[slackin@dabass]

hmmm when i bought my album i wasnt charged 3 mill, actually it was 13.99 in state. metallicas new album lists on walmart.com for 18.00 but wait, wasnt it a lot less to produce?ah yes turning a profit is better than paying the bills... haha just pickin

axl has more money than he knows what to do with. fuck his profits... same for metallica. i suggest anyone that's worried about rockstars' profits go and watch the south park episode "Christian Rock Hard" and tell me...

do we really need to donate more money to axl and lars' bentlys and mansions?

i answer myself with a loud "no"

[bassist_25]

Ya, when a guy who calls himself "Buckethead" and wears a Micheal Myers
mask paired with fast food "attire" says yer nuts...well...there might be some
issues...

[tornandfrayed]

So that brings up a good point, are we thieves or are we music lovers?

When a musician has financial success does that really mean that it is OK to steal from them? Or from anyone? Is it OK to steal or do we just go out of our way to justify it?

I know that a lot of albums are not to my taste, but does that mean that it is OK for me to steal it?

I have had meals that I was not crazy about but I never thought that a dine and dash was appropriate.

Where is the line? If we think that Axl has enough money do we only steal from him and pay for the Slacker Theory CD or do we just steal all of it? Or do we pay for all of it because it is a form of art and art has to be supported at any expense.

I'm not bustin Slacker Theory but I do like their music and I would pay for a CD.

So where is the line and who gets to be the judge?

In my personal opinion the digitization of music could very well signify the end of people being able to make a living at creating their art.

IMO....

PS not meant to be a hijack, just following the train of thought cause that is what I do....

[Banned]

So that brings up a good point, are we thieves or are we music lovers?

When a musician has financial success does that really mean that it is OK to steal from them? Or from anyone? Is it OK to steal or do we just go out of our way to justify it?

I know that a lot of albums are not to my taste, but does that mean that it is OK for me to steal it?

I have had meals that I was not crazy about but I never thought that a dine and dash was appropriate.

Where is the line? If we think that Axl has enough money do we only steal from him and pay for the Slacker Theory CD or do we just steal all of it? Or do we pay for all of it because it is a form of art and art has to be supported at any expense.

I'm not bustin Slacker Theory but I do like their music and I would pay for a CD.

So where is the line and who gets to be the judge?

In my personal opinion the digitization of music could very well signify the end of people being able to make a living at creating their art.

IMO....

PS not meant to be a hijack, just following the train of thought cause that is what I do....

Well thought out post, and I have to agree with you. I just know that the people who say they download music without paying, probably do not do this any other time. If you want and or need something of value, you have to pay for it in real life. Why would music be different?

[tornandfrayed]

This is it, I am going to say it.....

I agree with you Joe.

The whole state of the download community worries me. As a gamer I worry that if most people pirate software the quality of the software produced will go down. I worry also about the artist who need to make a living. We can all agree that a record company might not need to make so much money but what happens when people can no longer make music full time?

just a thought...

[Ron]

I saw on the news recently that the recording industry is giving up on pursuing and prosecuting illegal music downloaders. They don't have the resources.

[slackin@dabass]

So that brings up a good point, are we thieves or are we music lovers?

When a musician has financial success does that really mean that it is OK to steal from them? Or from anyone? Is it OK to steal or do we just go out of our way to justify it?

I know that a lot of albums are not to my taste, but does that mean that it is OK for me to steal it?

I have had meals that I was not crazy about but I never thought that a dine and dash was appropriate.

Where is the line? If we think that Axl has enough money do we only steal from him and pay for the Slacker Theory CD or do we just steal all of it? Or do we pay for all of it because it is a form of art and art has to be supported at any expense.

I'm not bustin Slacker Theory but I do like their music and I would pay for a CD.

So where is the line and who gets to be the judge?

In my personal opinion the digitization of music could very well signify the end of people being able to make a living at creating their art.

IMO....

PS not meant to be a hijack, just following the train of thought cause that is what I do....

but how much is a metallica or guns and roses concert ticket? if i had the moeny and they were as close as philly, i'd buy a ticket to a show. i love metallica. they have always been one of my top 3 bands, even after st. anger. same with g n r. i've always liked them. when i saw dream theater in pittsburgh ages ago, i paid 50 bucks for the 3rd row. that's cheap compared to metallica tickets. remember, alot of these bands that bitch and moan about people taking their music online also charge an arm and a leg for live tickets.


you'll be happy to know that slacker theory still (usually) only charges 5 bucks to come and see us, though

i also think that with music being free, people are more stimulated to pay for a concert ticket.

now, i know that i am probably the only person that feels this way, but any un-signed band should charge for their cd, what it cost to make that disc, plus another disc. basically, say you buy a bulk of 100 cd's for 200 dollars. that's 2 bucks for each disc. when you sell them, you should charge 4 dollars. that's enough to buy another disc to replace the one sold. as a local musician... aren't you trying to get your music out there and be heard? who wants to pay 10 dollars for a cd that no one has ever heard of outside of the people that happened to be at that bar on that night? i know i wouldn't. i understand people want to make money. that's why there is a cover charge. but if you want to be popular... shouldn't you make everything more affordable to the people your trying to appeal to?

just my opinion. and i'm sure i'm pretty much alone in thinking this way.

[bassist_25]

i paid 50 bucks for the 3rd row. that's cheap compared to metallica tickets. remember, alot of these bands that bitch and moan about people taking their music online also charge an arm and a leg for live tickets.

To play devil's advocate - You have to remember that there are lot of people with their hands in the cookie jar that are taking their cut before the band sees any percentage of that ticket sale. The same holds true for an album too. You may think that you're sticking it to the record company by downloading a song, but actually, you may just be making it even harder for a band already living on the breadline to pull itself out of debt from when it first inked its record deal. It's only the superstars with longevity who live in mansions and drive Bentleys. Lots of musicians who have had hit records take day gigs after their star falls. But I digress. I'm not a fan of the over-commercialization of the concert experience to begin with, and that's just one of the many reasons that I'd rather go see a hot band in a small club or theater than fight it out in the rat race of some corporate-sponsered mega-concert. I have much respect for Garth Brooks when he came to the Brice Jordan Center and demanded that people weren't gouged at the ticket booth or he wouldn't perform. Of course, some promoters and agents on the local and regional scene have their hands too far in the cookie jar, IMO, and that hurts more deserving bands...but that's a tangent for another thread.

I think that Dave brings up a lot of good questions, though. I'm not going to sit here and preach like I've never downloaded a song. Hell, I just played three sets of other people's material last night. However, I love this art medium and I don't want to see it devalued either. I'm probably going to be one of the last people to get an MP3 player, because I like the idea of buying a piece of physical media that has all of the artwork and "Thank You" sections. Regardless of how I feel, though, the music industry is changing. Those who are innovative and forward-thinking will succeed. Those hung up on archiac business and marketing models will fall by the wayside...or they'll try and litigate themselves in a futile attempt to remain relevant as the recording industry has tried to do. I suspect that's what the oil industry will probably do too once renewable energy sources become even more affordable and realistic for the average consumer. Maybe recording an album is just going to be another business expense rather than a direct means of making capital, kind of like paying rent on a facility or buying liability insurance. It's going to be interesting to see how things unfold in the next couple of years.

[f.sciarrillo]

I saw on the news recently that the recording industry is giving up on pursuing and prosecuting illegal music downloaders. They don't have the resources.

Seeing that they are losing court cases, I can see this happening.

As for if a cd is worth it or not? If like it I will buy. If not, then I delete it from my hd. The only problem is that a lot of the new music that comes out nowadays is not worth it.

[Ron]

I'm pretty sure that the only people that make big, big bucks in the music industry (who aren't record executives) are songwriters and producers.

[MY_TURNING_POINT]

When Stept on was negotiating a deal with McGathy Productions in NYC many moons ago, I think we were offered about 2 cents on every cd we would have sold if we were signed. Everything else went to pay back potential producers, recording costs, equipment rentals, and any other expense that was put into making that album. Then the mgmt got a cut as well.

Maybe alot of bands that got signed faired out better than the deal we were being offered but after all was said and done I dont think I'd want anyone stealing my 2 measly cents. I'm sure Axl and company are a lot better off but, wether you like em' or not , they earned it. The new bands are getting ripped on all the pirating. Buy the disc to support the band you like or they may not be around much longer for you to enjoy!

[Jared Michaels]

I heard and I HATE IT!

It totally Fu**in Sucks!!!

[DirtySanchez]

My theory-

Steal it first. if you like it, buy it.

If it sucks- Do not buy it.

This is also why I am a strong believer in premarital sex.

How would you like to get married then find out she didn't do ass to mouth?

[DrumAndDestroy]

How would you like to get married then find out she didn't do ass to mouth?

hahahaha!

[Banned]

When Stept on was negotiating a deal with McGathy Productions in NYC many moons ago, I think we were offered about 2 cents on every cd we would have sold if we were signed. Everything else went to pay back potential producers, recording costs, equipment rentals, and any other expense that was put into making that album. Then the mgmt got a cut as well.

Maybe alot of bands that got signed faired out better than the deal we were being offered but after all was said and done I dont think I'd want anyone stealing my 2 measly cents. I'm sure Axl and company are a lot better off but, wether you like em' or not , they earned it. The new bands are getting ripped on all the pirating. Buy the disc to support the band you like or they may not be around much longer for you to enjoy!

Kind of reminds me of the first music contract that Duane Allman signed when he was a studio guitarist. He got $0.02 for every record sold that he played on. You can see this contract at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.

[slackin@dabass]

My theory-

Steal it first. if you like it, buy it.

If it sucks- Do not buy it.

This is also why I am a strong believer in premarital sex.

How would you like to get married then find out she didn't do ass to mouth?

you say it so succinctly

[metalchurch]

My theory-
Steal it first. if you like it, buy it.
If it sucks- Do not buy it.

I agree with you 100%
When I first started my CD collection 8-9 years ago, I had already paid for them in the cassette version, so I already "paid" for most of my music anyway....
The "burnt cd's" I download because it's so hard to find some of the music I listen to, and I still have quite a bit of burnt cd's becuase of the lack of availability of the originals.

I do buy the original version of the music that I have, so it's like a cheap preview for me I guess.

I've found some amazing music from downloading that I never would have had the chance to hear otherwise, so I'm very glad to have that resource available to me.
Primal Fear for instance was one of those bands, and now they are one of my fav bands ever, and I eventually bought everyone of their cd's because I like them so much...

[f.sciarrillo]

My theory-

Steal it first. if you like it, buy it.

If it sucks- Do not buy it.

This is the point I was getting at ...