Rhythm Guitar

grimmbass · Post by **grimmbass** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

Guys,

As a bassist who enjoys being "heard" (i.e. LOUD), I've always had a bias for one-guitar bands. I like having the rhythmic sonic space to myself....just curious how my brothers and sisters on the bass feel about dealing with rhythm guitar?

Love it? Hate it? What do you think?

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

I'm rather ambivalent when it comes to that issue. (Man, I just got home from a gig, and I should be posting rather than sleeping...I mean sleeping instead of posting, but I digress...)

Having a single guitar does allow for some more sonic space, but sometimes, it's impossible to fill that sonic space. There are songs where you have no choice but to pound out the 8th note roots, and having a beefy rythmn guitar helps there. Other times, you can go crazy with runs and fills and really lay out a solid foundation under a single guitar. Sometimes I drive the guys nuts when we're picking new material because I'm real objective with how the stuff is produced. I might say, "There's no way we can pull that off with a single guitar" or "There's way too many harmony vocals in that song." I try to lay a good foundation under old sKool's solos, but as I said before, sometimes I have to just stick with roots. That's when I'm hoping that the sound engineer's keeping me big in the mix. *LOL*

But if you want to hear my honest opinion, unless Rob picks up a guitar, I have not interest in paying another player. Five pieces just aren't all that profitable. *LOL* Besides, old sKool does an excellent job of covering multiple guitar parts. We do Cold Hard Bitch, and he plays both the "main" part, and the strange off-time second guitar part. I've always been of the school (or sKool, if you will) of thought that it's better to have three or four excellent players than five or six mediocre players. I'm sure we've all have seen the old "seven piece band with four guitar players" type of group. The reason is because nobody is a strong enough to hold their own, so they fill out their sound by having a million pieces. But that's a tangent for a different time. I really need to get to sleep. *LOL*

SpellboundByMetal · Post by **SpellboundByMetal** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

Two guitar assault, thats how i think of it. Plenty more heavy and LOUD.

Just out of curiousity, who the HELL is old skool , and why the HELL does everyone quote him like he is God's gift to guitar?
I would think a good guitar player would NOT want to play mindless top 40 stuff. I havent seen your guitar player post on here ever. Im not calling him "old skool" , thats fuckin retarded.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

SB,

You were a cool guy when I met breifly met you. Unfortunatley, I don't recall anyone quoting old sKool as God's gift to guitar. But I think that before you attempt to have a credible opinion about someone's musicianship, you should do a little woodshedding on your own instrument, because frankly, your technique is horrible.

Then again, maybe people with poor musicianship can't get hired by bands playing "mindless top 40 stuff". *shrugs*

Punkinhead · Post by **Punkinhead** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

I pretty much like a one guitar assault, unless it's like Nevermore and they both are really, really, really good. I'm more into using a keyboard to fill the space that can't be filled by having just one guitar actually. It seems to leave space for other instruments by not having constant noise (like alot of rythym guitar) but filling spots that need filled. But, generally I like the musical freedom of a one guitar band myself too. If you can have one well, you don't have to worry about the power, it will be there.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

Being a good rhythm player in a band is an art in itself. It requires a lot of discipline, especially when it comes to volume and tone. A great rhythm player can get exactly the right sound needed at the right volume level consistently thru a night.

Unfortunately, Paul is right. Its really tough going 5-piece these days. My hat's off to those bands who do.

SpellboundByMetal · Post by **SpellboundByMetal** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

Bassist_25- i wasnt being a dick, i was inquiring. i didnt say anything about his musicianship, ive never heard him play!!!! As far as my horrible technique- FUCK YOU. Youre a top 40 coverwhore. you dont write songs, you dont create shit. You copy bands and try to take THEIR fame. Wannabe i think is the CORRECT term. Monkey see, monkey do. Use your brain and write shit. Id rather suck (hahahahaha) doing my own thing, than be awesome at ripping people off. I never had lessons, so yeah, i bet my technique sucks to theory-heads. OH WELL, i can live with theory-heads not liking my playing. They dont mean SHIT to me. I play from the heart, not from a book...and I SURE dont dedicate my skills to playing other people's shit.
Like i said, i wasnt attacking his musicianship like you did mine. Thats cool though. Dont make any attempt to see anything i play in. I dont want you to lower your standards, dick.

Sapo · Post by **Sapo** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

I hate having a rhythm guitar covering up my sound. I prefer one guitar bands. I view my bass as providing both the bass and rhythm guitar functions by incorporating some grit in my tone.

My experience has been split...I've played in lots of both one and two guitar bands (and even keys)...and I am always happiest in bands with no second guitar. I have put lots of time and effort into getting my tone and I am no longer willing to have it buried by a another instrument. I can't ever imagine playing in another two guitar band...unless AC/DC calls me up.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

SpellboundByMetal wrote:Bassist_25- i wasnt being a dick, i was inquiring. i didnt say anything about his musicianship, ive never heard him play!!!! As far as my horrible technique- FUCK YOU. Youre a top 40 coverwhore. you dont write songs, you dont create shit. You copy bands and try to take THEIR fame. Wannabe i think is the CORRECT term. Monkey see, monkey do. Use your brain and write shit. Id rather suck (hahahahaha) doing my own thing, than be awesome at ripping people off. I never had lessons, so yeah, i bet my technique sucks to theory-heads. OH WELL, i can live with theory-heads not liking my playing. They dont mean SHIT to me. I play from the heart, not from a book...and I SURE dont dedicate my skills to playing other people's shit.
Like i said, i wasnt attacking his musicianship like you did mine. Thats cool though. Dont make any attempt to see anything i play in. I dont want you to lower your standards, dick.

No, everything in the post you made was condesending. I have said it many times: I don't care if it's covers or originals, what genre, ect. There's one things I respect, and that's quality. This issue was never covers vs. originals in the first place, anyways. But that's just what pretentious people say to hide from the truth. While they're standing around with their heads up their asses strumming on the same two power chords (which I don't consider to be all that "original"), the wannabes are usually having success. *shrugs*

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

Sapo wrote:I can't ever imagine playing in another two guitar band...unless AC/DC calls me up.

Malcolm's so low in the mix, I don't think it would matter. *LOL*

BDR · Post by **BDR** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

SpellboundByMetal wrote:I would think a good guitar player would NOT want to play mindless top 40 stuff.

Waa ... waa ... no one comes to see my band so I'll crack on an entire contingent of this site to make myself feel better ... waa ... waa ...

It never ceases to amaze me how self-righteous and bitter people can be, all at the same time. This "original vs. cover" crap got old about 1,000 years ago. There are TONS of original musicians on this board who have an awesome product -- The Grimm, Hurricanes, The Opposition, just to name a few -- and don't feel the need to create division on this site with a piss-poor, boo-hoo attitude. People go to their shows because they KICK-ASS (and they don't scoop their mids).

Do what makes you happy and let those around you do what makes them happy. If it pisses you off because what others are doing draws a crowd, then supply a product that people will enjoy.

SpellboundByMetal wrote:Im not calling him "old skool" , thats fuckin retarded.

... yes, but "SpellboundByMetal" is so not retarded.

It's the guy's nick name. You don't have to call him old sKool if you don't want to, there's no requirement. I think he'll sleep OK at night knowing some dude who's got it all figured out in Martinsburg, Pa. doesn't approve of his nick.

r:>)

BDR · Post by **BDR** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

Punkinhead wrote:I'm more into using a keyboard to fill the space that can't be filled by having just one guitar actually.

I'm with Punkinhead ... I'd bring keys in before a second guitar. The reason:

old SKool is a GUITAR GOD!!!

LOL

r:>)

BDR · Post by **BDR** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

BTW ... "old sKool," for those of you who don't know him, is pretty much the most humble, easy going dude I've ever met in my life and he really has no idea how good he is. I know there's a shit load of people on this board that have been floored by both his talent and his complete lack of cockiness.

If you ever saw him play, you'd take a dump right in your pants, then he'd offer to drive you to the store to buy new jeans. He'd probably even give you the money for them ... that's f@$kin' retarded.

r:>)

tornandfrayed · Post by **tornandfrayed** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

And the beat just goes on... The same shit... We are like hackers, if we would commit our energy to helping each other we could change the fucking world!

But we don't. We tear at each other and work so hard to bring each other down...

We should reconsider.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

That post says it all, Torn. Good job.-------->JMS

SpellboundByMetal · Post by **SpellboundByMetal** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

OK
Bassist_25- same two power chords? i dont think you know what you talking about at ALL. You can keep trying to attack my playing, which like i said before is cool. You havent ever seen me play guitar so, whatever. I play BASS in OGS. Im not even gonna attack your playing because im not a tiny dickface like you. What's more funny is you consider playing top 40 cover tunes to drunk people success...I DONT AT ALL. Im glad youve found happiness in your lack of creativity.

BaddazeRob- I never said ANYTHING about anyone coming to see any bands. Why are you changing it? Youre such a cover whore, youre promoting your show even in an argument. thats sad, man. I dont have a boo hoo attitude! Nothing about what i said implys i do. You just think you are SOOO badass. WHAT THE FUCK DOES SCOOPING MIDS HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING?
you are grasping for shit here, you little goofy frontwoman. You are ripping on metal with that lame-ass comment. What a turd. I wouldnt have your face representing my band EVER. Thank GOD youre in a cover band.

guitar god, hahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaha. ok !!!! Nothing about top 40 is NEAR guitar god status. I have NO problem with your guitar player OK?? I stilll havent said anything about HIS playing, and i wont...but YOU two badgayz are arrogant nutbags, and i KNOW im not the only one who thinks so. Hows THAT for horrible technique?

Oh yeah, and keep passing out the snickers. Reminds everyone of the poop you play, kind of a visual suppliment.

daveb · Post by **daveb** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

I started out pretty much as a rhythm player. Then split time evenly on rhythm and lead. The important part of the process, the discipline, is to be good at playing your part. Don't go about playing rhythm like you're bored and just waiting for your time to solo. Be as proud of your rhythm playing as your lead playing. Learn the part correctly, pay attention to getting the chords voiced right. The right tone and volume. You can't play at the same volume as you would if you were the lead player. Listen to old Steely Dan, Queensryche and Kansas songs. There are some amazing rhythm tracks going on there. Not just two guys making the mix muddy by playing the same thing on top of each other. Now, having said all that. I've been playing with some guys lately and I'm the only guitar player. There is a keyboard player, but only one guitar. The material we're doing suits a one guitar approach with is also important. Why do one guitar music with two guitars?

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

SpellboundByMetal wrote:OK
Bassist_25- same two power chords? i dont think you know what you talking about at ALL. You can keep trying to attack my playing, which like i said before is cool. You havent ever seen me play guitar so, whatever. I play BASS in OGS. Im not even gonna attack your playing because im not a tiny dickface like you. What's more funny is you consider playing top 40 cover tunes to drunk people success...I DONT AT ALL. Im glad youve found happiness in your lack of creativity.

I heard the Blood Empire stuff or whatever it was. It wasn't anything that would make Steve Vai proud. Actually, some of the stuff was out of time with the drums from what I remember. I don't care if it's "original" or not; get the fucking mechanics of music down first. As far as what I do - I'm happy with it. I really don't care what anyone else thinks. I'm just not bullshitting myself into thinking that I'm doing anything more than what I actually am. I support whatever anyone wants to do. I just get sick of the guys with their heads up their asses who have the elitist opinions when there's nothing to be elite about. Obviously, I've struck a nerve somewhere if you insist on arguing with me about it.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

p.s.

Bad Daze
Saturday, March 18th
County Line Inn

If you like mindless top 40, this is the show for you. I know that we can't be as original to post cliche shit about playing from the heart and trying to emasculate our adversaries by purposely mistaking their gender, but at least we have Snicker's, they satisfy.

JeffLeeper · Post by **JeffLeeper** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

Wow , guys....This thread went south in a hurry.
Step back and look at your own chops before you jump on someone else's.

That's just not cool at all. We're all in this together , and the sooner we see that the better off we'll all be.

I'm pretty old school , myself , but there's a pile of good chops I'd love to steal from every player I've ever heard. We've all got something uniquely personal to add to the music scene , and tearing each other down is about as counter-productive as anything I've seen the last 28 years of doing this.

Victor Synn · Post by **Victor Synn** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

SpellboundByMetal wrote:OK
Bassist_25- same two power chords? i dont think you know what you talking about at ALL. You can keep trying to attack my playing, which like i said before is cool. You havent ever seen me play guitar so, whatever. I play BASS in OGS. Im not even gonna attack your playing because im not a tiny dickface like you. What's more funny is you consider playing top 40 cover tunes to drunk people success...I DONT AT ALL. Im glad youve found happiness in your lack of creativity.

Dude, not cool at all. I've talked to you privately about how original and cover bands should work as a unit to make this scene better. This makes you come off as a huge hypocrite. You also come off as being extremely jealous of cover bands and the success they typically have around here. This has always been a cover heavy scene. Might not be fair, but it's the truth. You can either continue to create your originals and hope they catch on or be one of the "bitter masses" and bitch about how people who play covers lack creativity.

Bassist...I understand that SB ripped on old skool, but I don't think you really had to go where you went about SB's playing. Might not be your thing, but it might be good enough for what he's doing in One Gun. If you enjoy what you're doing, that's great, but take the high road.

BDR · Post by **BDR** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

tornandfrayed wrote:And the beat just goes on... The same shit... We are like hackers, if we would commit our energy to helping each other we could change the fucking world!

100 percent agree.

r:>)

SpellboundByMetal · Post by **SpellboundByMetal** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

Vic- i dont mind some coverbands. And yes, we did talk about uniting coverband vs original. I may come off as jealous, but i assure you im not. I dont know why people wanna hear the same poop thats on the radio, but thats the way it is here, youre right. I can live with that. I dont know why original bands arent also embraced. I just cant bring myself to treat a coverband with the same respect as an original band. All the hard work and great ideas are allready done when a band is a cover band. Basically, if you want to be popular around here, play popular stuff.....kinda cheating if you ask me. id rather suck playing original stuff without a doubt.

bsaller · Post by **bsaller** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

daveb wrote:I started out pretty much as a rhythm player. Then split time evenly on rhythm and lead. The important part of the process, the discipline, is to be good at playing your part. Don't go about playing rhythm like you're bored and just waiting for your time to solo. Be as proud of your rhythm playing as your lead playing. Learn the part correctly, pay attention to getting the chords voiced right. The right tone and volume. You can't play at the same volume as you would if you were the lead player. Listen to old Steely Dan, Queensryche and Kansas songs. There are some amazing rhythm tracks going on there. Not just two guys making the mix muddy by playing the same thing on top of each other. Now, having said all that. I've been playing with some guys lately and I'm the only guitar player. There is a keyboard player, but only one guitar. The material we're doing suits a one guitar approach with is also important. Why do one guitar music with two guitars?

Sooo true...the voicing is what rhythm is all about!

bsaller · Post by **bsaller** » Sunday Mar 12, 2006

JeffLeeper wrote:Wow , guys....This thread went south in a hurry.
Step back and look at your own chops before you jump on someone else's.

That's just not cool at all. We're all in this together , and the sooner we see that the better off we'll all be.

I'm pretty old school , myself , but there's a pile of good chops I'd love to steal from every player I've ever heard. We've all got something uniquely personal to add to the music scene , and tearing each other down is about as counter-productive as anything I've seen the last 28 years of doing this.

Aw Jeff ! What do you know!!! Your only a rhythm/bass/lead guitar player that also sings!!! Ha!Ha!

ROCKPAGE

Rhythm Guitar

Rhythm Guitar

And

Wow

Re: And

Re: Wow