Who makes their living solely playing music?

[facingwest]

Kenny and I have been playing anywhere from 5 to 6 nights a week and this is what we do for a living now. July is going to be really challenging because we have a few days where we're playing 2 back to back gigs. We're trying to learn the word pace, so we can make it through these shows. Once we get to Key West, we're going to be playing 4 hour shows without breaks. I'd rather prep for that now, than go there only to fail because we can't cut it.

[musicmadman]

WOW you guys are one of the lucky One that CAN make there living Playing Music My hats OFF to ya, I used to be able to do that in the late 70's and early 80's in Altoona I used to be able to count on the band Money But any more all you can hope for is to get enough to cover your gas to and from the show, and maybe if your REAL Lucky you may be able to get a Cup of Coffee for that LONG Ride home, a lot of clubs that I've worked in DON'T pay unless you bring a bus load of People, so times have Changed, you have bands playing in certin ares of the state and there playing for book money and bringing there friends and the friends are Drinking the Clubs beer debt away, YOU CAN'T WIN.
I hope this post DON'T offend some OVERLY SENSITIVE People if it does I am sorry, but it is what I have encountered
Good luck guys and keep up the GREAT work

[tonefight]

My hats off to all of you who are playing for a living, I've looked at some of your schedules and estimated finances. Its not bad till you look at paying medical , what about retirement etc.

I'm a hobby musicians and thats all I ever really wanted to be.

I did have a stint when I was about 18 / 19, the band I was in at the Time called Montage hooked up with an agent who promised us 5 nights a week , since all our day jobs sucked we went for it. It was cool but even at that money stress kicked in after about 5 months and I got a job and bailed ( there were a few other reasons ) I don't regret it though it was definatly a time to remember ( although there are many nights I forget )

[facingwest]

My hats off to all of you who are playing for a living, I've looked at some of your schedules and estimated finances. Its not bad till you look at paying medical , what about retirement etc.

I think about that every day of my life and with a walking time bomb for a lung, I have to (my lung collapses for no reason what so ever). Hopefully, by the beginning of next year, we're going to have some kind of medical plan and a small 401K. Might not be the best, however, it's at least something. Right now, I have an accident and sickness policy that'll pay me money whenever I need it and only costs 40 bucks a month. Gotta start somewhere.

[redawg]

I've been making my living doing music in some way for 3 and a half years now.

[HurricaneBob]

Moi!

[dayzichick]

There are many ways to be a professional musician that doesn't involve solely being in a band or playing in clubs. My husband has been a professional musician since he graduated high school and he's 35 now. He is music director at a church for his full time job, but he plays weddings and makes decent money doing those, more than we make in the club per person most of the time. He plays for school functions when they do musicals or recitals and need a keyboardist, private parties for corporations who want background mood music, writes and produces and sells his own CDs, records live performances of community bands, and of course he plays in Ribbon Grass and the Dave Single Trio, those are the major things I can think of right now. There are jobs out there, you just have to be creative to think outside the club scene and don't sell yourself short when it comes to charging fees, not everybody can play an instrument well enough to make a living at it. For those who do, they deserve to make a fair wage because it is such a specialized field.

[songsmith]

When I made my living playing in a local country band, and it was a decent living, people would ask, "...so, what do you do?" I'd say, "I'm a musician." SO many times I got that "look," and something to the effect of, "oh...I see," like I was selling crack or something. People have their preconceptions of what a local-level musician is, and what kind of person they are. Have you folks experienced that?---->JMS

[ZappasXWife]

Well, one thing I know is that when I watch Felix Kos sing 'Turn the Page' it makes me sad...I think he has gotten those looks before. Damn rednecks!

[dayzichick]

Songsmith, we both get the same thing constantly. You gotta love the person who comes up to you at a gig and says, "boy your band is great, is this all you guys do for a living?" I know they are just asking to ask but the way some people ask the question, their tone of voice is like, "is this ALL you do?" like it isn't real work, you know? Like somehow being a musician isn't a "real job" The other thing that is somewhat strange to me is when strangers come up to you at a gig and then name every band they've ever seen and give you the rundown. I know maybe they are looking for something to talk about but it's not like I go up to a fellow graphic designer and start talking about who are the best and worst graphic designers in town. If I want to talk about music, I'll come to this site. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind having discussions with people in clubs, it's just that sometimes it's tiring to talk about your job all the time.

[facingwest]

I've come to the realization that I don't really care what people think of my profession. They will never see that a musician is more dedicated and actually works harder than just about every other field of work. A good thing to throw back at the person saying comments like Terri mentioned to you is to ask them what they do for a living and do they actually like going to work. I was in college about a year and 1/2 ago for computer networking. I realized part way though that my calling has always been music and why am I running from it. There are others out there making a comfortable living at music and I need to start doing the same. Imagine a job that you actually look forward in going to it. The job is fun because you get to be yourself and do what you LOVE to do. I remember coming home from a management position working at a NAPA with so much stress and too many headaches that it started to run me down. Now, I work at my own pace and put more hours in, but enjoy doing it. I've come to realize there aren't enough hours in a day to get everything done, however it's not stressful to me. To make a long story short, I love what I do and thank God every day of my life that I can do this for a living.

[SUperstar]

I have been doing nothing but music for about 2.5 years now. I had the same looks and questions you are talking about. My girlfriend's mother is the worst though. Mainly b/c she has a crazy leftover 1950's mentallity! She loves to say things like.. "well when you get a real job..." etc. But yes my tax forms say: MUSICIAN. And that makes me feel good. It great to eat breakfast at 11am!!

I do a similar thing to John and Kenny.... playing tunes on guitars.. lots of fun. I do requests from a list of over 700 songs- mostly classic rock but with everything else also like Pearl Jam, U2, STP, AIC and stuff like that as well as some country classics from Merle, Hank Sr., Waylon, John Denver etc. It's nice doing it as a solo act b/c there is no one to split money with. I am able to play 3 days a week and live very comfortably. Health insurance eats some cash every couple of months but it has to be there. I looked at your schedule (John & Kenny) and that's crazy hectic. I can only imagine you are living very comfortably. I would guess about $300/show. BUt then it gets split. I am very lucky b/c bars/restaruants up here (Northern PA/Southern NY) treat there talent very well w/ food/drinks and a good pay scale. A 3 hour gig for $200 + food and drinks!! It's great!

I would be interested to hear what you guys are able to write off as business expenses come tax time? I keep receipts for everything- Picks/strings/gas/drumsticks (for my cover band) I rent a detached garage from my house and use it as a rehearsal space/party room and write that off. Internet expense due to website maintanence etc. What about you guys? Just curious- but not if it's too personal. Good luck on the trip to the Keys...have some fun. I will be watching for the live webcast!!

[songsmith]

I write off everything but gas, and I should do that. Guitars and other big-ticket items get depreciated over time, and string n things get written off 100% right away. Okay, to do that, you have to admit income, and claiming a loss every year is a one-way ticket to audit-ville, so do what's right. If you don't, don't try for a record deal. I know a guy who played for many years before going to Nashville. He got a publishing deal, and fortunately had a big hit song cut right away. His first royalty check was $20K. The VERY NEXT day, the IRS sent him a notice... they had audited some clubs he used to play, and they figured he owed the IRS $19K. Bummer.------>JMS

[facingwest]

Even though we have a heavy schedule, this area doesn't pay all that well. To make $300 in a night would be great, but from a bar owner's point of view, you have to draw a REALLY good crowd for them to consider. Right now, we set our minimum for a 3 hour show on a weekday to $120. Unfortunately, that is split two ways. Until we build a name for ourselves, we're not going to be able to get too much more than that. However, I like playing as a duo for a huge list of reasons. Something that's been helping us out tremendously is we have no pay out for bookings, website (coming soon), etc... We do all the work.

As far as writeoffs, instead of writing off gas, you're going to find that you'll be able to write off milage (round trip) for each gig. We keep receipts for everything that's purchased. ISP, phone line, clothes, etc.. are writeoff's as well. If you use it as part of your show, it can be claimed. From what I understand, everything except for souvenirs are considered a writeoff when we go to Key West.

Does anyone know of any insurances and medical plans for working musicians?

[SUperstar]

NEat... this is a neat discussion. Good to hear from others in similar situations. I have Central Reserve Insurance. It's nothing fancy but it does everything I need and is really there if anything big ever happened (FINGERS CROSSED!!!!) Mileage not gas... thats cool. Phone line too huh? Makes sense.

Sorry to hear about the pay scale. I would stay that busy too for only $60 bucks a night.

The clubs and restaruants I pay are all cash. Wouldn't know if I could ever ge cought up in anything w/ audits. My dad's account does all of my stuff. He says I am very safe- Knock on the wood. I would love to get the Variax Acoustic Line 6 has put out... or the new Bose PA with the skinny pole- anyone see them? Definitely want to be able to right it off though!

[facingwest]

I heard the Bose PA and think it's cool. You can hear a change in sound moving around though. I heard one when I visited Key West a few months ago, then went and tried one in Pittsburgh. The only thing that's stopped us from getting one is of course the price. We're under a tight budget and did buy a PA for $800. It does the job and sounds pretty good.

You can write off anything you can think of that ties into your job. Just have the receipts in case you ever get audited. As far as milage, it's 30 some cents per mile. I don't remember the exact figure though.

[bassist_25]

I agree, this is a great thread.

After realizing that the IT industry in this area is a wasteland, (as with just about every field around here, but I digress) I knew I had to go back to college and make a career change. I knew that I needed to make money while I was in school, and I knew that my schedule would be pretty full. (I was getting turned down for jobs I was way overqualified for without mentioning about going to college, so I can just imagine the hell I would play when employers found out they had to schedule around my classes) I decided to return to playing, and I decided to start a business. I'm still in the midst of setting up the business, so much of the money I'm making is from playing.

When it comes to careers, my motto has always been, "Life's too short to spend it doing some shit that you hate". I mean, you spend 1/3 of your day at work, so it might as well be something that you enjoy doing. It's all about priorities; it's not everyone's dream to have a nuclear family and a house out in the 'burbs. Unfortunatley, our society seems to judge people on their income, and how new of a car they drive, or how big of a house they own.

I've learned, if you truly want to be paid what you are worth, you have to work for yourself. I have always done my own thing, so why should my career be any different? You could go work for some corporation that will pay you dick, screw you out of promotions because of office politics, and then kick you out on your ass when they find out that Pablo will work for 1/4 of your pay, (No offense to anyone of Mexican descent, just illustrating a point) or you could take a risk, realize that you can take charge of your own destiny, and live the ultimate dream.

[bassist_25]

BTW, when it comes to taxes, that's where a good accountant comes in handy. If anyone's interested in a great and affordable accountant, drop me a PM, and I'll get you in contact with mine.

[dayzichick]

Well I have an article from Berklee Today magazine written by an associate professor who is a public accountant, tax specialist and professional musician. His name is Martin Denneby and the article says to contact him at mjdenneby@juno.com for more questions. It's a recent article because it is in the 2004 Spring edition. Here are the things he lists as allowable deductions for musicians: mileage of .36 cents/mile, parking, transportation and food expenses, rehearsal space rental fees, telephone expenses (the taxpayer must have at least two lines to qualify for this deduction. Cellular service is considered a second line.) Stage clothing and dry cleaning expenses (only outfits appropriate for stage) full or partial cost of a computer, software for contract writing, music editing, notation, and sequencing, costs associated with Internet, ISPs, Web site development and hosting charges, promtional costs : photos, mailings, cost of throwing a Cd release party, instrument and/or voice lessons depending on circumstance, cost of rented or leased equipment, new musical equipment purchased, equipment repair or maintenance costs, cost of vaccinations for foreign touring, cost of applicable insurance (equipment liability, worker's comp, health and dental insurance), a portion of home mortgage deduction (if office space or rehearsal space is maintained there) cost of tax return preparation. Wow, that is a lot of stuff. Guess Dave and I should start saving receipts huh?

[facingwest]

Wahoo!!! If 36 cents per mile is what it is, we're not going to have to worry about anything. Round trip to 7 Springs from my house is 145 miles (round trip. 145 X .36 = $52.20 I get to write off. That doesn't include the other expenses involved. For Key West, we're looking at 3000+ miles that we'll be able to write off. From what I understand, from the time we leave for the trip, we can write off everything, except souvenirs. I'm starting to set up everything for taxes.

[facingwest]

After updating taxes, I thought about this thread and decided to update on it. As it stands with the receipts I've kept, I've managed to come out a little ahead this year for taxes. If all goes well, I might only have to dish out about $400 so far for the year. Even though we made decent coin playing in Key West, the expenses that we were allowed to write off helped with the rest of the year. The milage writeoff alone was $1,134. and that doesn't include parking, hotel, food, etc... I'm going to set up an appointment with my accountant to see if I'm doing everything the right way. I'd just like to thank all that posted on this subject because it really helped me a lot.

[facingwest]

Well I have an article from Berklee Today magazine written by an associate professor who is a public accountant, tax specialist and professional musician. His name is Martin Denneby and the article says to contact him at mjdenneby@juno.com for more questions. .......

FYI, his name is Martin Dennehy and his email address is mjdennehy@juno.com Thank God for google.com.

[tonefight]

Are there any online articles on this ( tax stuff ), alot more establishments are keeping records and although I usually spend more than I make and it is just a hobby , I better do a little better book keeping as to not get in hot water.

[facingwest]

I just don't want it to come back and bite me in the ass, so I'm going to claim 100% to be on the safe side.

[tonefight]

100%!!!!! Crips, all the mileage and expenses, you've gotta write something off. Playing as little as we do my expenses will probably outdo my earning from playing. Crips you probably got over $300 dollars in mileage write off on your trip to florida and you're going back soon right? I'm sure you'll do buisness while you're there right? Another $300 write off ?

If you were getting doctors wages I could see giving the government more than they deserve but not on musicians wages!

I think you'd be further ahead to pay someone to do it if you're worried. It's you're money keep what you legally can.