Whats the proper etiquette?

[DickShackBass]

First question: You're playing a venue that gives you 100% of the door money. You asked another band to open for you this night, said band brings a crap load of people to the show, who also stay and see your band through to the end of the night. At the end of the night your band makes, say, $600 from the door. Do you typically give the opening band SOMETHING, or do you keep all the door money for yourself and opening band gets no money?

Second question: If the venue you play at has a sound man there, and he makes you sound great all night, is it proper for the band to give some of the money they make to the sound man as a tip or is that not something that is done?

[Rich]

IMO... With the band - I think that would have been something you would have worked out before hand. If you didn't and you drop them a buck or two. They would definitly see it as cool deal... Plus that's between you and your band mates...

The sound guy - If he did you a great job. I'd definitly give him a tip. That will insure you a great job the next time...

Nothing like feeling appreciated in either case...

[DickShackBass]

IMO... With the band - I think that would have been something you would have worked out before hand. If you didn't and you drop them a buck or two. They would definitly see it as cool deal... Plus that's between you and your band mates...

Oh yeah, just wondered what the norm is. I know what my feelings are and we all talked about it as a band and all. I just wondered what is normal for everyone in general.

thanks!

[CMOR]

Any band I've been in has given some cash to an opening band, if for nothing else, gas. Choking Faith has tried to hook any band up with what we could.

As far as the soundman question goes...Speaking as a house soundman, I get paid regardless by the bar owner, but a little extra would never hurt. It won't insure good sound the next time, I try to make that happen every time, every band. It's my job.
Actually, I sometimes get a band's disc, which is cool. I can throw that in a week or two before they play there again just to get people's interest.

[mjb]

thats a good question, like rich said , it's good to have that all out there up front. in these days, i personally would try to help out the opener with at least fuel money. thats just being cool. if you can do it. if your makin 600. and your not paying for a sound guy you should be able to throw the the opener a few bucks. what the hell.

i would throw the sound guy a bone too, if you can. now if you played for the door and only brought in 150 bucks then theres only so much you can do obviously. but hey, 600 gives you a little something to work with. i say if you have a good night share the wealth a little bit, it's good karma so to speak.

some people may be hard asses and figure screw everybody else and they have to pay their dues and so on. well............. that attitude only going to get you so far no matter what your doing. imho.

do what you can, in this case, sounds like the opener helped you guys out withbringing some people to the show and stuck around to hear you guys.

it was cool of you guys to give the opener an oppurtunity to play so you already kind of did them a solid to begin with. throw them a couple bucks for gas (IF YOU CAN) and your a pretty cool band in my eyes. you have costs too, don't forget. i guess every situation would be a little different though.

[DickShackBass]

do what you can, in this case, sounds like the opener helped you guys out withbringing some people to the show and stuck around to hear you guys.

WE were the opener ha ha!

[DrumAndDestroy]

I think the opening band deserves something...especially with gas prices the way they are. In the punk/whatever scene we are in, there is an unwritten code on helping out your fellow band. That kind of thing goes a long way...and that's how you forge solid friendships. And that in itself means more than money.


As for the sound guy? No...if he's employed by the bar then he's already making a set wage regardless of how you sound or how many people show up. A simple "thank you" can go a long way too. Unless you know him...then give one or 2 lines of coke out in the parking lot before/after the show. I like being paid in drugs...that's a money saver.

[mjb]

do what you can, in this case, sounds like the opener helped you guys out withbringing some people to the show and stuck around to hear you guys.

WE were the opener ha ha!

ooops, sorry andrea, i misunderstood well, doesn't really change anything from my post.

[lonewolf]

You should talk money before the gig, not after. In this case, when booking the gig, ask for either a set amount for expenses, or a small percentage of the door, like 10% or 15%.

After all, this ain't LA and that band wasn't Kiss.

As for the sound guy? If he is getting paid by the house, buy him a beer and thank him.

[DirtySanchez]

We split it up evenly. Thats the way it SHOULD BE. The 1st band that played worked just as hard as the last to prepare and play their set. Now, if it's a band we opened for and they gave us 30 bucks to open for their rockstar asses 3 1/2 hours away. You will get 30 bucks.

IDK though, there are alot of local rockstars who just do this for money,and will fuck you cuz you're "the opener" LOL!!! Live and learn.
Or ask to "OPEN" another show with them and steal some equipment.
Most of all, tell other bands who these dickfucks are so we all don't get boned.

[DickShackBass]

Or ask to "OPEN" another show with them and steal some equipment.

hmmm...Im in dire need of a new bass amp! hahaha!

[nightcrawler_steve]

************************

[DirtySanchez]

Yeah, what Steve Said. I just play punk and Metal, we don't have "OPENERS". We just split shows. If I ever "HEADLINE", I better be
doing a tour for Metal Blade or something. Headlining @ the local watering hole just seems funny and inflated to me. As a matter of fact we've taken a hit when playing close to home so the "opening acts" had cash for gas and eats.

[BDR]

After all, this ain't LA and that band wasn't Kiss.

"The last time I opened for a band, it was KISS ..."

Sorry, this is an inside joke, but for the record, it's really funny.

r:>)

[BDR]

Gray areas abound ...

• If you're "presented" with an opener by the venue, I don't feel you're under any obligation to pay the other band(s). It's the club owner's job to strike a deal with the band he or she booked.

• If you book a band to open because you don't have enough material to play the whole night, you should pay them something. After all, you hired them to provide a sservice that night.

• If you're giving an up-and-coming band an opportunity to play in front of a ready-made crowd, then that, IME, is compensation more valuable than $$$. This is a business of patience and we've all played our share of "no-$$$" opening gigs to get a foot in the door, so these bands should realize the value in getting the chance to shine in front of someone else's fan base.

• If you're booking an opener at a club you're not established in to generate new faces in the crowd, then the opener is providing you with a service, especially if they produce the bodies. Pay them something, even if it's gas money.

As for sound techs, again, a house engineer is paid by the club and that is generally reflected in the amount of $$$ that is handed to the band at the end of the night. If he or she did a killer job, tips should be at the discretion of the band, but as a general rule, we let the club pay the house sound guy.

As lonewolf suggested, we make sure to let the sound tech know we appreciated the good mix and beers are usually a good way to show that.

r:>)

[DickShackBass]

Thanks for all the responses everyone. I appreciate all the advice.

[Heartless_Mockery_Records]

I was gonna post a reply but as I looked over it BDR pretty much said everything.

so +1 for everything he said.

[bassist_25]

As far as in-house sound engineers go, the best thing to do is be professional and above all, BE APPRECIATIVE. They deal with enough primmadonna wannabe-rockstars walking through the door, so if you can come in with a pleasant demeanor, it's going to make the whole experience a lot better. This is the one and only thing that I'll ever toot our own horn about in public, but sound engineers dig working with us because we come in with good attitudes, conduct ourselves professionally (e.g., don't "noodle" while the engineer is getting levels on other instruments, we don't tune live through front of house, etc.), try to have good and professional tone "right out of the box" before the signals reach the board, don't ask for 10 bazillion different monitor mixes on stage, keep our stage volume conservative, and don't try to act like we know more about sound reinforcement than the person behind the desk...because the fact of the matter is that we indeed don't know more. I know that anytime we play City Limits/30 Something, Zilly's happy to see us walk in because he knows it's going to be an easy night. Anyways, that's my advice when it comes to dealing with the sound issue. I've only ever walked out of a gig twice pissed off at an engineer and with 95% of our gigs having full FOH support, I'd say those are pretty good numbers.

As far as an opener - Here's a retorical question for y'all. What do you do when the opener starts driving your crowd away? Yes, it happens.

[VENTGtr]

What BDR said.

We've had a few bands open for us, and it's always been to get them
playing time, or so they can let a place see them, etc. Really, unless
it's something like that, people are generally playing a full show as it
is.

We've also opened for others to help them out for various reasons.
That kind of thing is more of doin' a favour and I/we haven't expected
to get paid.

If it's something like 2 bands just splitting a show, then, ya, work it
out in advance.

[DirtySanchez]

As far as an opener - Here's a retorical question for y'all. What do you do when the opener starts driving your crowd away? Yes, it happens.

I know you said Rhetorical, but I'd really like to see some discussion on this because it indeed does happen.

Sometimes it's simply because the genres/style of the music is so different and fans usually aren't as open minded as we wish they were.
In this case I'd say the intentions were good, but the result was not. I would just politely ask the opening act to shorten their set. You may not feel good about doing so, but understand it's in everyones best interest (including the opening act, because they're prolly not setting the best impression on the club owner whereas if they were playing with a band that was more in the same style they would set a better impression by not having patrons complain/walk out).

BUTBUTBUTBUT other times , It's the opener is HORRENDOUS!

In this case I would still not be a dick (maybe they were just anxious and started playing out before they were ready? or They are new to the game and having some stagefright issues?). Regardless of why, you gotta put an end to it. Tell'em to wrap it up after they finish butchering whatever song their currently "playing". For the same reasons listed above.

AND YET ANOTHER SCENARIO:
they are a bunch of whiny Primadonna types, (or just the frontman is ) and think they deserve everyones utmost attention and DEMAND "Everyone git your asses up here on the dancefloor" and blah blah blah. (Or shall I say WAAHH WAAHH WAAHH). In this case I'd be rather blunt about stopping them and have no problem telling them exactly why. (Because they're making you look like assholes by association and even confusion, cuz that's YOUR band name on the marquee, not theirs.) Plus I'd let them know their egos are unacceptable and to not contact you about any shows in the future.

I'd prolly even give the first two some money for their troubles and effort, but I'd consider sending the last one an invoice and have them write your fans an apology that can be displayed on your myspace. haha seriously though.

[nightcrawler_steve]

*****************

[Plastered Bastards]

If you have 3 bands,you split it 3 ways. If it's 2 bands 2 ways.
Or be a dick and keep the money for an 8 ball.
Seriously,we (Plastered Bastards) in one instance,if your band is from way outta town.Say Cali or from Europe or so.We feed them and give them most of the money because they are on tour and when your on tour if you don't have a reasonable guarantee,your fucked.
So we hook them up because it's good karma and believe me, karma works.