Singer who is getting discouraged

[Pure Evil]

B-o-o H-o-o

[tonefight]

Leave your address maybe we can send you some tissues

[byndrsn]

Aja,

When I posted my initial reply, I was all too interested in possibly jamming with you sometime, and still am if you're up to it. Now I do have to tell you that we do a lot of Classic Rock, but we're not limited to that and get into some heavier stuff from time to time.

Obviously, none of us can speak to what you've experienced with bands in the past, we haven't "walked" in your shoes so to speak. But, since everyone else has offered their two cents...... here's mine.

I think you should re-evaluate the reason you want to get out and jam. I don't know where or who you've tried to get in with, and it really doesn't matter at this point anyhow. The brother & SISTER hood that has formed throughout this area over the last 15 + years has come from one thing..... the love of music! The love of sharing it with anyone who wants in..... not a "I want to be the center of everyone's attention and the world of music revolves around the fact that I'm the best thing that happened to a band" attitude.

It takes a lot of hard work from everyone in it! The one thing that makes it all the more worth while here is that we all support each other in our endeavors..... that's a fact! I've been to shows where the band had a rough night, I've played shows where I wanted to crawl under a bottle at the end of the night because of how bad I thought we did. But I never experienced anything in this scene but encouragement from my peers... I also haven't run into anyone convinced that they're God's gift to music either.....

With that said, give everyone around here a chance and I think you'll find a bunch of "mini" successes are right around the corner that will lead to what you want.... but you have to want it for the right reasons!!

Good Luck and look forward to hearing you sometime!!!!

Dan

[aja]

I really don't know where you guys are getting this GOD'S GIFT TO MUSIC attitude that you think is coming from me. Never once have I bragged about my music skills. Not once. All I ever said was people were blowing me off and making me out to be this little girl who wants to get into a band.

But if you want to hear me brag I can.

I am a performance Major at Berklee College of Music in Boston. My principle instrument is voice. I can LOOK AT A LEAD SHEET and sight sing the notes without even having to hear the music. I can play the piano. I can transcribe out melody lines. I can write lyrics and songs.

I have performed in front of 1000s of people on the Berklee Theater. I played tons of gigs around the local Boston circuit.

NEVER ONCE, have any of you ever heard me say those things, or even brag about them. I kept my mouth shut. All I wanted to do was just join a band.

SO don't sit there with your words of encouragement like you know something I don't. I have done way more than any of you and I am only 21. I got EDUCATED IN MUSIC. I am no play by ear wanna be.

AGAIN, YOU NEVER HEARD ME SAY THOSE THINGS. I don't brag.

All I wanted to do is get into a band. However, you have to have people want you in the band. I am only getting a few offers now. When I posted no one was responding to my requests. So I simply took out a thread that said I am discouraged. It is a normal human behavior. Than people started defending guys in this local town like they are perfect. No one knows what I went through, I dont tell. I get dissed a lot by guys in bands. Then when the fight broke out and I got mad, now people are giving me some offers.

I had to be a bitch to get them. When I was nice no one was bothering me.

So as you can see, if I wanted to brag from the beginning I could. However, I DIDN'T. I don't like to tell people I went to Berklee in Boston. It creates negative vibes from most people who are play by ear, because I find tons of flaws with their work. They get intimidated by my education in music. So again, I never wanted to mention it.

What I think I have to do, IS GO BACK TO BOSTON. There is way more opportunities there for me than here in PA.

[RobTheDrummer]

Maybe you can showcase your talent at the felix/rockpage jam. I think it will be a good way to meet other musicians in the area. Just a suggestion.

[tornandfrayed]

I think at this point that we all need to hear you. It would be cool to go to the jam mentioned in an earlier post and have some fun. I know that I for one would show up just to see you and hear you!

[Punkinhead]

Somehow I seem to have gotten lost in all this....
You want people to judge you based solely as a musician, yet don't let them know all your credentials and merit?

What is there to interest someone in auditioning you? Just that you want to be in a band? You know how many times a musician hears these lines:
Yeah, I'm in a band or Yeah, I want to start a band?

So what was there for anyone to go on?
You had to raise hell to get offers, well you showed something in raising hell that could make someone want to audition you/start a project...

As for doing more than anyone else here, and all us "hick ear training boys...":

I can't let that go untouched...You have no idea what you are talking about, and need to research the facts before you go into something like that....There are many educated musicians in this area, some Berklee grads even. There are even people in this area who know so much about music that they couldnt take it in school because they know more than the professors....There are people in this area who have been or are on labels, been on tours, television shows and all sorts of shit...I think you mistook this area for a bunch of talentless hacks

[facingwest]

Well whether you mean to or just naive, its that very attitude that kind of makes me mad. Acoustic show? Why just acoustic show? Why not a full blown metal show with heavy distortion? IT is that same old mentality that guy groups have. Maybe you see female singers more than just groupies or backup singers, but yet you still do not see us as more than flower power acoustic singers.

What are you talking about here? All I was trying to do is be nice and invite you out to sit in with us while we're playing. We are an acoustic duo. How the heck can two guys that play acoustic guitars do a full blown metal show? Geeze....

[bassist_25]

I have to agree with Punkinhead on all accounts. I found it strange that you were vague in everything you said and then wondered why you got a lukewarm response. You didn't give any hint to your expierence but then became indignant when people tried to give you advice.

As far as having formal training; big deal, I have formal training too. I can also sight read (well, it's a little rusty ), improvise over a Jazz chart, write a melody, write music, and play the piano. Going to Berklee still isn't a guage of your talent since there's no audition requirement to get accepted. Even more so, a lot of people get formal training and still can't play without music. There's a difference between playing a mixolydian scale and understanding why it goes over a dominant 7th chord. What do Yngwie Malmsteen, Kieth Horne, and Buddy Rich all have in common? They are all masters of their respective instruments and none of them had formal training.

And to think that no one here has ever accomplished anything.....where should I start? Pure Evil has performed on national TV, Mark Middleton use to play in Raging Slab, one of the local drummers now plays with Seether, ect.

It's cool to not like the scene. There's a lot of things about it that pisses me off. But to be condesending just because you are "educated" shows in actuality that you have a lot to learn about music. I'm not posting this to flame you. Everything you say seems to be candor, and everything I say is also candor. Again, I don't know what it's like being a women trying to play music. If anyone blew you off for being female they are idiots. Not everyone is like that though. It would be cool to see you at Felix's jam, but if you come in with an attitude you're not going to get a warm welcome.

(now I'm done posting to this thread cause I don't want it to turn into "The Reason PT. II )

[facingwest]

Here's some advice I can give you Aja from looking at your posts. First off, that attitude will get you nowhere in this business. Secondly, you're going to win more bees with honey than you will with vinegar. Irregardless to what your background is, if you can't get along with other members in a band or the people in the business, you're not going to cut it. However, if you're looking for a possible opportunity, send me a private message. I might have something for you.

[aja]

First off again, who has attitude. Look at my posts. All I did was post a thread that says who I was, and that I was interested in joining a band. I got some views but NO ONE RESPONDED.

2nd, I took out a response to my own thread that says I was discouraged. All that is showing no negative attitude towards anyone at all.

3rd, I never mentioned Berklee because of what just happened. YOu guys are thinking that I am all high and mighty AND THAT AINT TRUE. Hence, I didnt mention it because of the way YOU GUYS ARE ACTING NOW.

I NEVER casted anything up. This is why I never like telling people I went to Berklee because of your typical cliche responses.
1 oh you think your soooo good because you went to Berklee
2 Berklee doesnt make you better than anyone else


Again, those 2 examples alone ARE WHY I NEVER SAID IF FROM THE BEGINNING.

I never said I was better than anyone else. I never said that HICK PA BANDS SUCK. Never, Never, Never.

LOok at my first 2 posts of this thread. HOW IS THAT HAVING AN ATTITUDE.


YOOOOOOU GUYSSSSSS are the ones to blame. YOu guys are the ones who pissed me off and disrespected me.

To the guy who invited me to an acoustic set. I got mixed up so I am sorry. I misunderstood you. I thought you had a FULL BLOWN BAND, but also did acoustic stuff on the side, and you were only inviting me to that. You made it sound like you had 2 projects and were assuming because I was a girl that I could only handle the acoustic.


You guys in this thread are over reading everything. What you people need to do is go look at my first 2 responses to this thread. HOw is that having attitude.

What I find funny is, all these people looking for singers in THIS FORUM, and not one responded to me. That is why I got frusterated and discouraged ( THOUGH I DID NOT SHOW ATTITUDE UNTIL LATER)

I even emailed a few of the people who were looking for singers and they never got back to me. Again, I WAS BEING BLOWN OFF.

No one here is looking for any hand me outs. My first 2 responses to my own thread SHOWS THAT.

Aggain, please don't take the Berklee thread wrong. I didn't even want to go there. You guys pissed me off and forced it out of me, treating me like some little girl looking to get in a band. I am more professional than that.

You have to realize I WAS CONTENT NOT EVEN MENTIONING GOING TO BERKLEE. So how is that making me think I am better than anyone because I went there?

One other thing you guys are failing to see is that it's just not band members that look and view women as lesser musicians. Often it is the crowd who the band plays in front. IF a good looking female singer is up stage the guys in the crowd look at her as a sex object and not a serious musician. They make comments like OH SHE CAN'T ROCK, BUT SHE HAS A GREAT BODY. They also heckle females as they are performing. I have faced that many of times, idiots out in a crowd coming to the front of the stage and saying rude shit. All that is part of women having to struggle for equality.

I performed one time and some jerk was at the stage saying TAKE YOUR SHIRT OFF SWEETHEART. He didn't hear anything I had to sing. Or see any of my talents other than wanting my shirt to come off.

MEN DON'T FACE SHIT LIKE THAT. Again, you guys are seeing just the band life, and that is hard enough. YOu guys don't realize what women face with crowds and narrow minded people.

One other thing you don't realize is the advertising. I tried to get my picture advertised at Pa-MD musicians web site. Right now disorderly conduct has their band pic up. I asked if the host would put my pic up cuz he is advertising a band for a week. Well disorderly conduct has been up longer than a week and he never put my pic up. I asked him if I could send a pic and he said he would put it up, OBVIOUSLY HE JUST WANTED MY PIC and never took me serious, because the pic is still not put up

So you see MORE HARDSHIP AND STRUGGLE.

[ToonaRockGuy]

Damn, that CHIP on your shoulder must be digging in big time!

Let's all take a breather and look back on things. Here's the bottom line:

-Aja is pissed off due to the fact that she can't break into a band and get taken seriously as a female singer.

-Aja vented that here on Rockpage.

-Aja got offered to sit in with Facingwest's accoustic act.

-Aja got offered to sit in with Wake Up Screaming.

-Aja got invited to sing at the Rockpage/Felix Vacation jam.

-Aja is still pissed, and still not singing with anyone.

And this is OUR fault? Just going over the two pages of posts, I've seen no less that 3 offers for you to get onstage and sing, girl! What's wrong with that? Singing is singing is singing.

And in your last post, you wrote, and I quote, "To the guy who invited me to an acoustic set. I got mixed up so I am sorry. I misunderstood you. I thought you had a FULL BLOWN BAND, but also did acoustic stuff on the side, and you were only inviting me to that. You made it sound like you had 2 projects and were assuming because I was a girl that I could only handle the acoustic."

Ummm, I re-read that post 3 times. Nowhere in it did FW insinuate that he thought you could only handle accoustic due to the fact that you're a girl. Fact is, FW does have an electric band. One of the hottest bands in the area, matter of fact. And I'm sure that if you talked to them, they'd let you sit in on a song...if you want to do some 80's dance/party music. OOPS, silly me, you want to sing METAL. So I guess that FW should change his "plugged in band" around to play metal for you, right? That's why you didn't get offered to sing with the plugged in band. They are an 80's party band, and THAT is most likely the reason you didn't get asked to do the plugged-in thing.

Also, just get off the high-horse thing, please. I'm talking about "SO don't sit there with your words of encouragement like you know something I don't. I have done way more than any of you and I am only 21. I got EDUCATED IN MUSIC. I am no play by ear wanna be. "

Nice. Veeeerrrrry nice. Like Punkinhead said, and like I said in my first post, don't you go judging us until you know us. This area has Berklee grads. We have players who have been signed, played nationally, been on TV, gotten record deals, and gone around the world. I didn't go to Berklee, but I am classically trained in drums, piano, and violin. I started playing at age 4. Over the past 15 years, I've played in bands that have won the South Carolina State Battle Of The Bands 3 years running, opened for Ted Nugent, Eric Johnson, Jeff Healey, Warrant, Winger, Skid Row, and more. I've played in front of crowds of upwards of 10,000 people in a stadium, 7500 in a concert hall, and crowds of 30 in a bar. And there are literally hundreds of musicians in this area with that kind of pedigree and MORE. Ive worked my ass off to get musical respect in this area, and I think I've succeeded to a decent degree, and I still don't consider myself one of the top-flight players in this area. I'm still working at it.

We're not judging you. As proven by your quote above, you are the one judging us.

Bottom line, Aja. We're not against you, as you seem to be hell-bent on thinking we are. You're pissed off, and you're taking it out on us, assuming that we think you're just some helpless, stupid girl that can't open a car door or sing "Row, Row, Row Your Boat". Some of the best damn singers here are women, and the guys that play in bands with them respect the hell out of them. And you can get there too in this area, just by taking the opportunities that are afforded to you and making the most of them.

I'm shutting up now. Respond if you like.

[mad hatter]

I wouldn't even entertain the thought of being in a band with you, Aja, judging by your attitude. Go back to Boston and be a bitch there.

[aja]

Get off my high horse. AHAHAHAHAHAHH. I was content not letting anyone know I went to Berklee. I think people are over looking that fact.

No where have I ever judged anyone here, or put them down like they were less than me. I am the one who is asking them. Not the other way around.

If you didn't piss me off so much, I would have never told anyone about me going to Berklee. So again, I'm not sure why that is a high horse issue.

In order for Berklee to be an issue of acting arrogant, I would have come into this forum and continually say I WENT TO BERKLEE, YEAH I'M BETTER THAN YOU, BLAH, BLAH. HOWEVER, I did NOT DO THAT. I was perfectly willing to keep that a secret.

The guy who has the acoustic set is contradicting himself. First off I knew he had an electric band and then he told me that is not true that he has an acoustic band. Now he is saying he has 2 bands and one is electric. He should make up his mind.

You have to look at this from my point of view. All you guys are doing is offering me spots to go on stage. THAT IS NOT THE PROBLEM. I ALREADY DO THAT STUFF. I want to be in A BAAAAAND. I dont want some night to just get up on stage and say look at me I can sing. So what, then what, what is to become of it. I already do that stuff. I already have sung in talent shows and live and in churches. What I am looking for is something permenant. I am looking to get into a band.

NOw I see tons of people looking to hire a singer yet none of those people ever approached me to give me a shot. I am not talking about people who already have bands and saying OH YOU CAN SING A SONG WITH US.

Big freakin deal. Again, I do that stuff now. I want to be in a band, and it is obvious that it is not going to happen here. People want singers yet they don't give me a shot. What happens is I am fighting with people who already have a band and are just giving me a shot to sing a song on stage.

So you can see, I really don't have beef with you guys technically, simply because you have a band and you can't see it from my point of view. You are seeing YOUR OFFERS. Well your offers don't get me in a band. They give me a chance to do what I AM ALREADY DOING. The people at these forums, ( THEY KNOW WHO THEY ARE) are looking for singers and yet still have not offered me anything or responded to my emails.

Don't pretend to know me or what I am going through or facing. Yes you may sit there and say WELL I WOULD GIVE YOU THE SHOT TO SING A SONG. However, that does nooooooooot help me.

[RobTheDrummer]

Hey Aja, you need to get off your ass and start telling people what you want in a band and what you are willing to do as a musician. Just saying you are 21 and a singer won't do much. Do you know how many singers there are that give that kind of line? You need to bring out what you have on the table and convince bands that they need a person like yourself. The worst way is to say something simple and not get a response and then get mad. It takes time and patience. It's a matter of playing the cards right and finding the right people. Just some words of advice. Making people mad does no good.

[rug]

aja,
you are as ridiculous as you are repugnant. god forbid if you sat in with any of these bands, who were gracious enough to offer, and someone may actually ask you to join thier project. gee, you wouldn't have anything to bitch about then. it looks and sounds to me like your true calling is digging graves as you are doing a superb job on digging your own. good luck in "OUR" scene finding a band.

rug....INVeRSION

[Victor Synn]

I performed one time and some jerk was at the stage saying TAKE YOUR SHIRT OFF SWEETHEART. He didn't hear anything I had to sing. Or see any of my talents other than wanting my shirt to come off.

MEN DON'T FACE SHIT LIKE THAT.

Come to a Hair Force One show sometime and see if that isn't the case. Look Aja, you aren't the only one on this board that has went through not being accepted into a band. I'd venture to say there are a lot of people (male and female) on this board that have went to an audition and thought they did well for themselves only to not be called back. I'm pretty new to the scene here as a vocalist and I can say that it took me a year from the time I decided I wanted to get a band started till the band was formed. You have an uphill climb in front of you. Not because of your gender, but because most people have a predetermined vision for what they want to see in their band. Some people see their band with a male lead vocalist. Some see it as a female fronted band. Some don't care. My opinion is that the people you contacted saw their band as a male fronted group. Don't cry Sexism simply because of that. Simply move on to the next offer. You're going to have to give in to the fact that people aren't going to fall at your feet begging you to be part of a band. You need to prove your worth as a vocalist. Such is the business. And the only way for you to do that is not look a gift horse in the mouth. I would take up the three offers you got on here and go prove your worth. What you fail to realize is that musicians can come in and watch these acts at any time. That's where these shows are more than just chump change. The first crowd I ever sang in front of was an acoustic show and I'm in an 80's hairband tribute now. Basically, don't bite the hands that feed you. And don't get frustrated because you came around recently and aren't playing Madison Square Garden yet. Take your time and be patient. And most importantly, take the chip off your shoulder. Because that is what will kill you in this area.

[HurricaneBob]

OMG, she didnt get in a band after 3 days on Rockpage, what a shame. She should be touring by now.

I have some friends at Berklee, musicians and instructors. Ill email them and see if they know you by aja. When were you there?

Berklee report card
Attitude = D-

[Victor Synn]

Berklee report card
Attitude = D-

LoL...Priceless.

[ToonaRockGuy]

ROTFLMAO @ Bobby!

BTW, Victor, great pic on JP's Year In Review! Congrats!

[dayzichick]

Aja, I'm sorry but you opened yourself up to the comments on here yourself with the previous posts. Every musician on this board has basically told you the same thing, male or female. Put your money where your mouth is and go sing with the people who have offered you spots to sit in. I've been a female singer in bands since the early nineties in this area. I would love to do many other styles of bands than I have done but when I first started out, I took whatever was offered so people could "hear me!" I tried out for bands and got turned down, I went to bars during happy hours and asked to sing a song or two so bar owners and musicians would take notice, and they did. I've done gigs for free in the beginning, just to sit in somewhere and have a mic and be on stage. Never once was I treated badly by any male musician or vocalist in this area. If anything I think females are more respected around here because there aren't many of them. And I'll bet if you ask most musicians what their careers were like starting up, they did the same thing, male or female, doesn't matter. And as far as people heckling you because you are a woman, it happens every night, deal with it. A smart girl would use that to her advantage. If it gets on your nerves, pick on the heckler in the mic, they will shut up almost instantly because you've singled them out. And since you studied at Berklee, you should be able to sing whatever style is thrown at you. So, take whatever comes your way just to get started. If you want to do heavy 80's and you can't find a band, then start one up, why don't you advertise that instead? The world owes you nothing. Make your own destiny. If you want to be in a band, then you have to find the right people. You've found them here in this forum but you aren't taking their help or advice. Pay your dues like the rest of us have, shit just doesn't fall in your lap, make it happen!!! I'll be waiting for your personal attack of how I'm a weak woman who probably gets slapped around if I don't get my husband turkey pot pies and beer every night. Good Gravy, go back and read through your posts, listen to yourself, who in their right mind would hire you? Your lucky you still have musicians on here willing to do that. Take them up on their offers and quit bitching.

[Victor Synn]

Thanks bro. I'm happy to be included in with some really cool company there.

[BDR]

I stayed away from this one for a while but it's time to chime.

Dwertz made the best point here so far early on...you joined Rockpage, posted an ad, waited THREE DAYS and then started whining. People answered your whining with offers of help and you kicked them in the teeth. Then, as much as you hate bragging about your background, you bragged about it for about ten paragraphs. Then, you kicked people in the teeth some more, followed by more bragging.

No band is gonna let you front them based solely on your schooling, especially if you're a vocalist. I know tons of people who have been schooled on vocals and can't hit a note no matter how hard they try. It seems like you want to skip the audition, move past the bar scene, go straight to the arenas and stadiums and play in front of 50,000 screaming fans based only on your hand written resume'. It doesn't work that way.

I sat in with many gracious bands, for a tune or two, years before I took the stage with a band of my own. I went to karaoke at clubs that ran bands four to five nights a week just so club owners and other musicians could HEAR me sing. Opportunities don't just happen, you have to make them happen.

Bottom line, no one here has ever heard you sing, your attitude sucks and in the words of mad hatter, "Go back to Boston and be a bitch there."

r:>)

[ToonaRockGuy]

I'll be waiting for your personal attack of how I'm a weak woman who probably gets slapped around if I don't get my husband turkey pot pies and beer every night.

That is freaking PRICELESS, ROTFLMAO!!!!!!

Turkey Pot Pie....mmmmmmm...

[Victor Synn]

"Shut up bitch! Go fix me a turkey pot pie." (Gratuitous Breakfast Club quote)