THE POLITICAL ARENA!!! Political Gladiators Inside!!

[Banned]

Ron Paul never voted for an ear mark. He just puts them in a bill to benefit his constituents . What a hypocrit.

Paul's district was (I don't know if it still is) a leader in receiving federal money. His response, "My people just want their money back". Never mind that they get MORE than they payed in taxes. I wondered why he was getting re-elected.

Video for Joe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s66bTshO ... re=related

If you watched the whole vid and others about this, Ron explains it perfectly. The federal govt is going to send money (back) to his district and his constituents know far better where their money should be spent compared to some bureaucrat in Washington, DC.

When the federal govt sends any tax money back to the citizens in any district or town, who knows how to better spend it and use it, the local citizens or some fed worker who was never in that district.

Now, if we can get the fed govt to stop stealing the money in the first place, the local districts would not have to get their money from the fed govt after they launder it (waste 90% of it on government bureaucracy).

That is the beauty of a reduced and Constitutional federal government, the citizens' money would stay in their local areas, not stolen and corrupted by Washington, DC.

Never mind that the get back more than they give ?

Get the federal government to stop stealing our money and this won't happen anymore.

[Banned]

Open for debate:
http://themoderatevoice.com/109988/ron- ... ights-act/

Ron Paul says property rights are freedom. This freedom outweighs the forced government civil rights laws. And he believes that if the property rights were in effect no one would hang up a sign saying no blacks. Is he naive ?

He dances like Joe.

Bill, when you grow up and start to think like an adult, maybe then we can have a discussion about freedom and liberty. Until then, feel secure in your socialist, authoritarian, fascist government. Hopefully someone from your beloved nanny state will come by and tuck you in tonight.

[lonewolf]

Ron Paul never voted for an ear mark. He just puts them in a bill to benefit his constituents . What a hypocrit.

Paul's district was (I don't know if it still is) a leader in receiving federal money. His response, "My people just want their money back". Never mind that they get MORE than they payed in taxes. I wondered why he was getting re-elected.

Video for Joe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s66bTshO ... re=related

If you watched the whole vid and others about this, Ron explains it perfectly. The federal govt is going to send money (back) to his district and his constituents know far better where their money should be spent compared to some bureaucrat in Washington, DC.

When the federal govt sends any tax money back to the citizens in any district or town, who knows how to better spend it and use it, the local citizens or some fed worker who was never in that district.

Now, if we can get the fed govt to stop stealing the money in the first place, the local districts would not have to get their money from the fed govt after they launder it (waste 90% of it on government bureaucracy).

That is the beauty of a reduced and Constitutional federal government, the citizens' money would stay in their local areas, not stolen and corrupted by Washington, DC.

Never mind that the get back more than they give ?

That's a neat trick...everybody gets back more than they give. Magic money!!!!

What do they do, get the Federal Reserve to print more money and loan it to them?

[songsmith]

I don't recall seeing a person call a teacher a criminal for getting a pension either.

You aren't looking very hard or suffer from conservative amnesia. Wingnut media abounds with crybabies who want to use teacher pensions as an excuse to eliminate public schools, bust teacher unions, and other nefarious and ludicrous excuses. Ignoring that may be convenient to the argument, but that's the reality.

I am glad Guadaffi (They spell his name ten thousand different ways) is dead. I have nothing against assisting in the taking him out. My only gripe is that it is something we should have done 30 years ago.

Thirty years ago, Reagan was president, and yes, we should have eliminated Gaddafi then. Then Bush Sr. Then Clinton, but any military or foreign policy he tried was destroyed by a GOP-controlled congress and a media who accused him of "wagging the dog." Then Bush II. Now it's a horrible thing again. That's that good ol' hypocrisy again.

My main point is that I have yet to see Obama get blasted for the wars, on stations like MSNBC, NBC, ABC, CBS, or PBS. But during the Bush admin, they were saying how terrible it was every night. If I remember right, MSNBC used to have a slot everyday where they announced the number of troops killed. If they are going to be unbiased and fair (Like they claim they are), and a true media outlet, they should be doing the same thing with obama. If you look, he is just continuing what Bush did, but yet there is no peep about it.

That is my gripe. If you are going to say it about one, you should for the other as well. Call it right down the middle and don't take sides on any of the matters.

If you're not seeing criticism of Obama on the so-called mainstream media, you're not watching. Every single one of those outlets is far more critical of Obama than they were the last 4 yrs of Bush, because for some reason, they give a sh*t about wing-nut accusations of liberal bias, and got gun-shy. If you want to see Fox News-style character-assassination and half-truth misinformation, stick with rightwing media. If you wanted the mainstream media to not say when Obama has achieved something, you're not being fair yourself. We don't all want to bury our heads in the sand like joe. Some of us have a need to see whats REALLY going on, not just have our conspiracy theories validated.

[songsmith]

Post away,I really don't give a rats ass about what you think or say.

Likewise, I'm sure.

Maybe people think you're the whack job? Go ahead and post some long,drawn out ramble with big words with all your vast political knowledge,I don't care. .

Apparently, you weren't around when joey and I covered this a long time ago: I'm not going to dumb it down any further. If you can't drive at speed, get over in the slow lane. I've jumped through enough hoops in this forum, and it's counter-productive.
I will take your advice, though, and start being more pro-active. I won't simply react to rightwing posts, I'm going to be posting a bunch of links you won't like. I'm also going to be making my own original points, instead of rebutting others. I know you'll be super-respectful and consider each point with sincerity and open-mindedness.

[songsmith]

On October 5th I said:

And Joe's masturbatory fantasy of an Obama impeachment (via Ron Paul's fantasy) is a dead-end.

On October 24th, brokebackjoe said:

Just one question, when you are in one of your masturbatory fantasies about your Kenyan, do you spit or swallow?

I taught joey a word!! See, he can learn! All you have to do is sting him with a reference to his dream-date, Ron "Snowball's Chance" Paul. His response wasn't original, by any stretch, but it shows low-level Pavlovian promise.

[Hawk]

Libertarian Ron Paul a Racist ?

Below are some racist remarks from his news letters. He once defended them. Now he says he doesn't know who wrote them. WHAT ? If we are to believe that the man produced a news letter IN HIS NAME and didn't know who wrote it or what was in it can he be qualified to run a country ? He's either a racist or he's just plain stupid. Likely he's racist as it dovetails with his belief that property rights trump civil rights.



Monday, May 9, 2011Unanswered questions; Why Ron Paul's racist newsletters still matter
I've just read an article that's brought back into focus an issue that I'd put out of my mind since the last presidential campaign: Ron Paul's troubling history of publishing racist columns. (Read here: Why Ron Paul's Racist Newsletters Matter | News One) The article outlines the content of columns written and/or published by Ron Paul in newsletters called Ron Paul's Freedom Report, the Ron Paul Political Report and the Ron Paul Survival Report, all of which listed Paul as editor and publisher. The columns in question are absolutely amazing: unashamedly racist, homophobic and paranoid. For your consideration, here are some excerpts from the writings of Dr. Ron Paul.

"Boy, it sure burns me to have a national holiday for that pro-communist philanderer, Martin Luther King. I voted against this outrage time and time again as a Congressmen [sic]. What an infamy that Ronald Reagan approved it! We can thank him for our annual Hate Whitey Day."
(jpg of source document here)


That column went on to suggest, in response to a proposal that a city be named in King's honor, that the city be called either "Welfaria", "Zooville", "Rapetown", "Dirtburg", or "Lazyopolis".

In another shocking column entitled "Blast 'Em?", Dr. Paul warns in dire terms of the dangers of black on white crime. Dr. Paul suggests that white people arm themselves with illegal, unresgistered guns, and goes on to relay the advice of a police officer that, if a gun were to be used to shoot a "youth", that the shooting be concealed and the weapon thrown away.

"(Carjacking) is the hip-hop thing to do among urban youth who play unsuspecting whites like pianos. The youth simply walk up to a car they like, pull a gun, tell the family to get out, steal their jewelry and wallets, and take the car to wreck. Such actions have ballooned in the recent months.

"In the old days, average people could avoid such youth by staying out of bad neighborhoods. Empowered by media, police, and political complicity, however, the youth now roam everywhere looking for cars to steal and people to rob.

"What can you do? More and more Americans are carrying a gun in the car. An ex-cop I know advises that if you have to use a gun on a youth, you should leave the scene immediately, disposing of the wiped off gun as soon as possible. Such a gun cannot, of course, be registered to you, but one bought privately (through the classifieds, for example).

"I frankly don't know what to make of such advice, but even in my little town of Lake Jackson, Texas, I've urged everyone in my family to know how to use a gun in self defense. For the animals are coming."
(Jpg of source document here)


You may remember that Ron Paul also published columns that stated that

"Opinion polls consistently show that only about 5 percent of blacks have sensible political opinions, i.e. support the free market, individual liberty and the end of welfare and affirmative action."
and

"Given the inefficiencies of what D.C. laughingly calls the `criminal justice system,' I think we can safely assume that 95 percent of the black males in that city are semi-criminal or entirely criminal."


and


"(W)e are constantly told that it is evil to be afraid of black men, it is hardly irrational. Black men commit murders, rapes, robberies, muggings and burglaries all out of proportion to their numbers."

and

"We don't think a child of 13 should be held responsible as a man of 23. That's true for most people, but black males age 13 who have been raised on the streets and who have joined criminal gangs are as big, strong, tough, scary and culpable as any adult and should be treated as such."

Those statements were first revealed in a Houston Chronicle article published in May, 1996. (Read here.) According to the Chronicle, Paul's congressional campaign responded to questions about these statements by saying that they were consistent with anti-crime statements by black leaders such as the Rev. Jesse Jackson. The Ron Paul campaign issued another statement, published in the Austin American-Statesman, that compared his newsletters to Tolstoy. (Read here.)

"Dr. Paul is being quoted out of context. It's like picking up War and Peace and reading the fourth paragraph on Page 481 and thinking you can understand what's going on."


Paul's defenses of these and many other outrageous columns have raised more questions than they have answered. His initial reaction to this issue, when it was raised by an adversary in the 1996 congressional election, was to admit to having written the columns and to defend their content as insignificant. As Matt Welch pointed out in a column for Reason (read here), statements made at that time by both Paul and his campaign staff accepted responsibility for publishing the columns and failed in any way to indicate that he hadn't written them or even read them. In fact, according to a contemporaneous report in the Dallas Morning News (emphasis added):

Dr. Paul denied suggestions that he was a racist and said he was not evoking stereotypes when he wrote the columns. He said they should be read and quoted in their entirety to avoid misrepresentation.

However, in 2008, Paul claimed that the columns, which he had said that he had written, which were written in the first person and which included references to his family life and other personal touches, had been ghost-written by someone of whose identity he was somehow uncertain. He claimed that it was completely plausible that he would allow people he did not know to author such columns for him, and that he would go on to publish them without prior review to his supporters in newsletters bearing his name in their titles. Such defenses by Dr. Paul insult those who legitimately want information about this troubling side of his record. Paul's answers to these legitimate question do not treat with appropriate gravity a very serious matter. They are not only inconsistent, they are self-contradictory. They are not only implausible, they are impossible.


Why do these newletters continue to matter? In publishing these newsletters, and in his handling of the resulting controversy, Dr. Paul has shown himself to be either a racist, an amnesiac, a liar, or grossly irresponsible. None of those are attributes one should look for in a prospective president.


Ron Paul's current candidacy for president once again raises the questions that he has failed to adequately address since they first came up in 1996. Who wrote the racist material that was published by him under his name in his newsletters? If the columns were ghosted, did he review them prior to publication? If not, why not? Why has he failed to take responsibility for and fully investigate the facts underlying this troubling publication of extreme racist propaganda into the political mainstream? If Ron Paul fails to answer these questions, fully investigate the matter and issue a complete and frank report of his findings, he will have failed to put the matter behind him. He can't just say that it's "old news" and leave it at that. That will only convince his true believers.


In conclusion, here's video of Ron Paul on CNN in 2008, renouncing the contents of his newletters and claiming that he can't possibly be racist because he "does not view people in collective groups". He also argues falsely and in offensive terms which immediately belie this absurd defense that the issue of the newsletters was being raised for a particular political purpose concerning a collective group. (At 2:40 of the below-embedded video.)


"(It is) part knock down Ron Paul because he's gaining grounds with the blacks. I'm getting more support right now, and more votes from the blacks because they understand what I'm talking about and they trust me."




In spite of the fact that the issue had come up in 1996, and that his campaign had at time defended them, Paul states in this interview that, prior to 2008, he was unfamiliar with any of the racist material from his newsletter. As I stated above, his defenses have raised more questions than they've answered.


[The full contents of the Ron Paul newsletters was uncovered in 2008 by the very persistent and clever research of Jamie Kirchick, then of the New Republic. (His great article on this is available behind a paywall here.) Julian Sanchez and David Weigel wrote in Reason in 2008 that they were of the opinion that longtime Ron Paul chief advisor Lew Rockwell was likely the author and almost certainly the real editor of the offensive columns. (

[Hawk]

If you watched the whole vid and others about this, Ron explains it perfectly. The federal govt is going to send money (back) to his district and his constituents know far better where their money should be spent compared to some bureaucrat in Washington, DC.

When the federal govt sends any tax money back to the citizens in any district or town, who knows how to better spend it and use it, the local citizens or some fed worker who was never in that district.

Now, if we can get the fed govt to stop stealing the money in the first place, the local districts would not have to get their money from the fed govt after they launder it (waste 90% of it on government bureaucracy).

That is the beauty of a reduced and Constitutional federal government, the citizens' money would stay in their local areas, not stolen and corrupted by Washington, DC.

Never mind that the get back more than they give ?

That's a neat trick...everybody gets back more than they give. Magic money!!!!

What do they do, get the Federal Reserve to print more money and loan it to them?

You aren't stupid. You know how it works.

[Hawk]

Open for debate:
http://themoderatevoice.com/109988/ron- ... ights-act/

Ron Paul says property rights are freedom. This freedom outweighs the forced government civil rights laws. And he believes that if the property rights were in effect no one would hang up a sign saying no blacks. Is he naive ?

He dances like Joe.

Bill, when you grow up and start to think like an adult, maybe then we can have a discussion about freedom and liberty. Until then, feel secure in your socialist, authoritarian, fascist government. Hopefully someone from your beloved nanny state will come by and tuck you in tonight.

Right. Adult thinking for Joe: Property rights trump civil rights. How's that Joe ? Did I get it right ? Oh, never mind. You don't like questions that expose what you believe.

[Hawk]

If you watched the whole vid and others about this, Ron explains it perfectly. The federal govt is going to send money (back) to his district and his constituents know far better where their money should be spent compared to some bureaucrat in Washington, DC.

When the federal govt sends any tax money back to the citizens in any district or town, who knows how to better spend it and use it, the local citizens or some fed worker who was never in that district.

Now, if we can get the fed govt to stop stealing the money in the first place, the local districts would not have to get their money from the fed govt after they launder it (waste 90% of it on government bureaucracy).

That is the beauty of a reduced and Constitutional federal government, the citizens' money would stay in their local areas, not stolen and corrupted by Washington, DC.

Never mind that the get back more than they give ?

Get the federal government to stop stealing our money and this won't happen anymore.

And....Paul is a hypocrit.

[f.sciarrillo]

Why don't you all just admit that every politician is a hypocrite. They all lie, steal, and cheat. And not one is completely right.

[Merge]

The generation that will inherit this country (though the plantiff in this video is no better).


http://revolutionarypolitics.tv/video/v ... o_id=15915

[Banned]

Note to the bald, stupid Nazi. Post a video of Ron Paul actually saying those things or apologize.

[lonewolf]

Never mind that the get back more than they give ?

That's a neat trick...everybody gets back more than they give. Magic money!!!!

What do they do, get the Federal Reserve to print more money and loan it to them?

You aren't stupid. You know how it works.

Yes I do. They get the Federal Reserve to print more money and loan it to them. That's not nearly enough, so they borrow the rest from SSI, China and anybody else who is willing to loan money at 1% to an obsessive-compulsive spender/borrower.

That only works until the IMF and the rest of the world stops using dollars as the world's dominant reserve currency. tic tic tic tic tic tic tic.....

[Banned]

Joe Biden gets 4 Pinoochios from the liberal Washington Post about his lies on the jobs bill.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fac ... _blog.html

Biden’s absurd claims about rising rape and murder rates....

In any case, the vice president should know better than to spout off half-baked facts in service of a dubious argument. Even if one believes there is a link between crime and the number of police—which is debatable and subject to many caveats—there is no excuse to make the dramatic claim that more people will die or be raped without additional funds for police. When making such a breathtaking charge, you had better have your facts straight.
Four Pinocchios

[songsmith]

Note to the bald, stupid Nazi. Post a video of Ron Paul actually saying those things or apologize.

Note to the fuzzy reality-challenged miscreant: Prove Obama's not from America or apologize.

[Hawk]

That's a neat trick...everybody gets back more than they give. Magic money!!!!

What do they do, get the Federal Reserve to print more money and loan it to them?

You aren't stupid. You know how it works.

Yes I do. They get the Federal Reserve to print more money and loan it to them. That's not nearly enough, so they borrow the rest from SSI, China and anybody else who is willing to loan money at 1% to an obsessive-compulsive spender/borrower.

That only works until the IMF and the rest of the world stops using dollars as the world's dominant reserve currency. tic tic tic tic tic tic tic.....

Still not the right answer.

[Hawk]

Note to the bald, stupid Nazi. Post a video of Ron Paul actually saying those things or apologize.

Which things ? The news letter things ? It's all over you tube. Search your self, he's your god. Check the CNN interviews.

[Hawk]

Joe Biden gets 4 Pinoochios from the liberal Washington Post about his lies on the jobs bill.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fac ... _blog.html

Biden’s absurd claims about rising rape and murder rates....

In any case, the vice president should know better than to spout off half-baked facts in service of a dubious argument. Even if one believes there is a link between crime and the number of police—which is debatable and subject to many caveats—there is no excuse to make the dramatic claim that more people will die or be raped without additional funds for police. When making such a breathtaking charge, you had better have your facts straight.
Four Pinocchios

Oh are you stupid ? (Remember Joe won't answer questions that expose his his beliefs .)

I read your statement and it was too intelligently written for you to have written it. Sure enough you cut and pasted it (no surprise) without ".

You failed to cut and paste this from the SAME article. " Clearly, the city of Flint supplied bad data, and either Biden or someone in Biden’s office should have caught it."

One man can't know everything. Biden's staff blew it.

[Banned]

Joe Biden gets 4 Pinoochios from the liberal Washington Post about his lies on the jobs bill.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fac ... _blog.html

Biden’s absurd claims about rising rape and murder rates....

In any case, the vice president should know better than to spout off half-baked facts in service of a dubious argument. Even if one believes there is a link between crime and the number of police—which is debatable and subject to many caveats—there is no excuse to make the dramatic claim that more people will die or be raped without additional funds for police. When making such a breathtaking charge, you had better have your facts straight.
Four Pinocchios

Oh are you stupid ? (Remember Joe won't answer questions that expose his his beliefs .)

I read your statement and it was too intelligently written for you to have written it. Sure enough you cut and pasted it (no surprise) without ".

You failed to cut and paste this from the SAME article. " Clearly, the city of Flint supplied bad data, and either Biden or someone in Biden’s office should have caught it."

One man can't know everything. Biden's staff blew it.

You fucking lying Nazi. I provided the link and the cut was from the article. You have to read it all you stupid fucking retard. Its the last paragraph. You are the one to cut and paste and do not provide the link to the original. Too afraid to show where you get your fantasies.

You are stupid and lie. Typical Nazi. You can now go back to swallowing with little stumpy.

[bassist_25]

Wait, I'm confused here. Are the people who disagree with UCJ nazis or communists? Do they want a hyperized meritocracy based upon the proposition of genetic superiority or do they want an egalitarian society with collective ownership of the means of production?

[Banned]

Wait, I'm confused here. Are the people who disagree with UCJ nazis or communists? Do they want a hyperized meritocracy based upon the proposition of genetic superiority or do they want an egalitarian society with collective ownership of the means of production?

Both. Libertarians want to be free and left alone. You should know this, you once claimed to be libertarian.

[bassist_25]

Both

My point is that they're two very different forms of facism, but you use them as if they're analogous.

You should know this, you once claimed to be libertarian.

Yep, I still am: A social libertarian. I'm fiscally moderate. Among other things, I see a fundemental flaw with Nozick's - and many other's - argument for fiscal libertarianism being based upon loss of agency vis-a-vie the state, because it ignores agency with regard to externalities created by private individuals and organizations. There are multiple forms of libertarianism - it's not just anarcho-capitalism. There's even socialist libertarism as forwarded by people like Peter Kropotkin. You should know this, as you claim to be a libertarian.

[lonewolf]

You aren't stupid. You know how it works.

Yes I do. They get the Federal Reserve to print more money and loan it to them. That's not nearly enough, so they borrow the rest from SSI, China and anybody else who is willing to loan money at 1% to an obsessive-compulsive spender/borrower.

That only works until the IMF and the rest of the world stops using dollars as the world's dominant reserve currency. tic tic tic tic tic tic tic.....

Still not the right answer.

Bullshit Bill. Its a zero-sum game. Without debt, Money In=Overhead Costs + Money out. It is mathematically impossible for everybody to get back more than they paid in. Unless its magic money. Is it magic money Bill?

The only way to add more money to the kitty is to borrow it. If they didn't borrow $1.3T last fiscal year, there wouldn't have been enough money to even fund DC itself, let alone send anything "back".

We are living on borrowed time. tic tic tic tic tic.....

[Banned]

Both

My point is that they're two very different forms of facism, but you use them as if they're analogous.

You should know this, you once claimed to be libertarian.

Yep, I still am: A social libertarian. I'm fiscally moderate. Among other things, I see a fundemental flaw with Nozick's - and many other's - argument for fiscal libertarianism being based upon loss of agency vis-a-vie the state, because it ignores agency with regard to externalities created by private individuals and organizations. There are multiple forms of libertarianism - it's not just anarcho-capitalism. There's even socialist libertarism as forwarded by people like Peter Kropotkin. You should know this, as you claim to be a libertarian.

Gee Paul, I did not realize that there are many forms of libertarianism. I tot we be all da saim.