Politics Politics Politics

FatVin · Post by **FatVin** » Thursday Dec 08, 2005

Did you know that Blair County may buy DRE election systems with no paper trail? It is a system where votes are just lost if there is a malfunction and it can not be checked if voters feel votes were not counted properly. They have until Dec 31st to decide on a system with a Voter-Verified Paper Ballot and routine audits. Please call these contacts and any others you know of and get others to do so as well. PA, especially Cambria and Blair may be the FL and OH of the next election if we don't stop this.

Karen Giles spoke to Director of Elections of Blair County, Shirley Crowl, and was told that they have not decided yet and she could not talk about it at this time. According to rumor, they are planning on paperless DRE.

Her phone number is 814-693-3900. I asked whom people could email about this and she said:
Director of Elections Shirley Crowl scrowl@blairco.org

Commissioner Gority dgority@blairco.org

Commissioner Wright bwright@blairco.org

Commissioner Eichelberger jeichelberger@atlanticbbn.net

Commissioner's office phone # is 693-3030.

Could you get other Blair people to call and email about this soon? Letters to the editor would help too.

Below is more information that might help you understand all of this.

WHAT IS NEEDED IN THE COUNTIES

Here is what needs to be done in each county (can get county contact info on our PA Database page http://www.votepa.us/PA_Counties.html

1) call county Board of Elections or Director of Elections and ask where they stand in the process of deciding what machines they are going to use or buy under the Help America Vote Act (HAVA). Please LET ME KNOW what they say so I can update the PA Counties Database!

2) If they are choosing a bad machine (i.e. a paperless touchscreen, etc.) we need to get people from that county to work on the Board of Election and their County Commissioners to try to get them to re-think this and get something better! The argument we need to use is that voters want the protection of a Voter-Verified Paper Ballot and routine audits of all elections. And -- VERY IMPORTANT-- tell the counties about the bills in the PA Legislature HB 2000 and SB 977 which will require the voter-verified paper to be available on the machines. Do they want to have to pay EXTRA to retrofit these new machines for printers??? Hope NOT! And tell them that these bills already have over 1/4 of the House and 1/4 of the Senate as co-sponsors so they are VERY likely to pass - they better buy a machine that can produce a voter-verified paper ballot or voter-verified paper record of each vote! More info about the bills here:http://www.votetrustusa.org/index.php?o ... Itemid=107

3) We MUST KEEP WORKING ON SUPPORT FOR THESE BILLS so that they will get moved out of committee in the State Legislature and so they WILL get passed. The best way is for people to visit, call, and e-mail their state representatives and their state senators. There is an easy, one-minute e-mail "blaster" (set up by VoteTrustUSA in conjunction with VotePA) here: http://www.congressweb.com/cweb4/index. ... hotissue=2

Go to this page for more info and ideas: http://www.votepa.us/actioncenter.html

Please spread the word and help get as many people as possible onto this issue -- it is SO important!

INFO ABOUT THE MACHINES

Here are some good links to learn about the machines. First, you might want to start with the movie Votergate. This is the movie we will be showing in State College on Thursday; you can also watch it online. http://www.votergate.tv

There are pdf files on our VotePA site which are good handouts, or just good to read:

http://www.votepa.us/resources.html

We have a Pennsylvania discussion group about these voting issues -- PLEASE join us! It is at:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/votePA/

And our links page has lots of good links:

http://www.votepa.us/links.html

Here are some good sites to visit:

http://www.votersunite.org

http://www.votetrustusa.org

http://www.verifiedvoting.org

Blain · Post by **Blain** » Thursday Dec 08, 2005

As I understand it, there was a mandate to eliminate the punch-card system, with a deadline to comply. It was an unfunded mandate.

Banned · Post by **Banned** » Thursday Dec 08, 2005

Has Blair county had a history of voter fraud?

YankeeRose · Post by **YankeeRose** » Thursday Dec 08, 2005

UCJoe, I'd wager the answer is "no" and don't you want to keep it that way?

Vin, is that the correct phone number? Karen sent me that one too and then also an e-mail with a "correction" of the phone number. I don't live in Blair County, but I did forward it to people I know who do!

Banned · Post by **Banned** » Thursday Dec 08, 2005

why are you trying to fix a problem that doesn't exist?

YankeeRose · Post by **YankeeRose** » Thursday Dec 08, 2005

Wanting to switch to a system with no verifiable paper trail, is doing nothing but asking for problems.

FatVin · Post by **FatVin** » Friday Dec 09, 2005

The info is good as far as I know, the e-mail adresses are solid anyway

Hey UCJOE, some of us think our vote is important, if you don't, that's cool. but what's wrong with a little preventative maintenance?

unfunded mandate or not why buy a machine that you know will have to retro fitted, why not buy the right machine in the first place

Am I wrong to suggest to Government that they don't waste my tax dollars any more than neccessary?

Banned · Post by **Banned** » Friday Dec 09, 2005

Vin, I agree with you about government spending. I tell people I belong to the Reduce the Size of Government Party. Unfortunately, there in no party like that now. The Libertarian and the Constitutionalist parties come closest and they have a snowballs chance in hell of ever getting to power in the country.
I guess I do not know how you are so certain they will have to replace these machines in 5 years. Do you know this or just a good assumption?

If Thomas Jefferson could come and visit this country he would die a thousand deaths for what we have done to this government.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Friday Dec 09, 2005

Is there even a good system out there yet that complies with HAVA's 2007 requirements?

edit:

Never mind. The question is answered. Leave it to Harrisburg. Do any of Rendell's relatives make polling machines? We should buy those so they will be sure to be legal in PA.

FatVin · Post by **FatVin** » Friday Dec 09, 2005

UndercoverJoe Wrote:

I guess I do not know how you are so certain they will have to replace these machines in 5 years. Do you know this or just a good assumption?

Somebody didn't read the whole post, let me repeat it for you...Don't worry I'll use small words.

1. Blair County is considering buying DRE voting machines to comply with HAVA 2007

2. DRE voting machine are all electronic and DO NOT leave a paper trail.

3. PA HB 2000 and PA SB 977 are PA House and PA Senate versions of the same bill requiring all voting machines in PA to have some sort of paper trail. These bills have huge support in the PA House and Senate and WILL PASS and will be LAW VERY SOON

Therefore:

If Blair County buys the DRE Machines they will have to retrofit them at additional taxpayer expense.

It's pretty simple, shouldn't be a partisan thing, even the anti-government conspiriacy theorists among you ought to be able to get on board this one.

Think about it, there are bills in the Harrisburg to require a paper trail so somebody's old college roommate is makng the right machine.

Banned · Post by **Banned** » Friday Dec 09, 2005

didn't have to get snotty

FatVin · Post by **FatVin** » Saturday Dec 10, 2005

Turns out that there is a solution

The Optiscan and the Auto mark system offers a Voter Verified Paper record. It's like those tests you did in high school...fill in the bubble

The other option is something called Accupoll that does work kind of like a DRE but ofers up a voter verified paper record. Of the machines out there this is the one most difficult to tamper with

Bedford County recently opted for an Optiscan system.

Look, What ever your place on the political spectrum, be it Arch Conservative or screaming liberal should every citizen's vote be counted accurately?

How hard would it be for you to send an E-mail to the address of your Blair County supervisors telling them you want your vote to count and that you don't want to waste money on a voting system that will have to be obsolete before it is installed.

In the time it takes to post about show rules or cover charges, you can do something that will really matter, that's all I'm saying.

Thanks