What rights do we have?

RAM Z · Post by **RAM Z** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

I have never thought about the GED too much cause I have honestly never needed it . I know it would really help me out if I did have one though! I look back on things that I should of done and could of done but,if I wouldn't have dropped out of school I might have never got to see and do the things I've experienced thus far in my life. Trust me, I know the down side to not have'n a diploma is hard on the back! I really don't have a problem bust'n my ass ,I have always been that way all of my life . The only thing I wish I would have obtained my GED and VO -TEC skills for would be to have my own paint shop, other than that, I just don't care. Like I said that was just a dream as a teenager,not to say I still wouldn't love to do it but, it I don't think about it much now that I'm older!

Remember years ago when there was no innernet? Guess who helped make it possible? That's right ME and people like me! I feel that I was part of this whole big change in our everyday lives that now everyone takes for granted! I can truthfully say ,I have put "thousands" of miles of fiber optic cables in the air and in the ground, actually the entire East Coast to be exact ! My travels, since I've been out of school have been great and I would never trade any of what I've done or seen ,except maybe see'n all the deaths along highways and see'n a man get hit with a train on one of our jobs! That "STILL" bothers me some though! He wasn't one of our workers just a stranger who felt it fit to kill himself for whatever reason it might have been! Let me tell ya you never want to see something like that and I would never wish it on anyone. That is really the only thing I would change if I could.

I have made soooo much money do'n what I did and that has never really helped with much at home besides bills and material things! I gave up alot of my family stuff to travel and make money.

YankeeRose · Post by **YankeeRose** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

RAM Z wrote:I have never thought about the GED too much cause I have honestly never needed it . I know it would really help me out if I did have one though! I look back on things that I should of done and could of done but,if I wouldn't have dropped out of school I might have never got to see and do the things I've experienced thus far in my life. Trust me, I know the down side to not have'n a diploma is hard on the back! I really don't have a problem bust'n my ass ,I have always been that way all of my life . The only thing I wish I would have obtained my GED and VO -TEC skills for would be to have my own paint shop, other than that, I just don't care. Like I said that was just a dream as a teenager,not to say I still wouldn't love to do it but, it I don't think about it much now that I'm older!

Remember years ago when there was no innernet? Guess who helped make it possible? That's right ME and people like me! I feel that I was part of this whole big change in our everyday lives that now everyone takes for granted! I can truthfully say ,I have put "thousands" of miles of fiber optic cables in the air and in the ground, actually the entire East Coast to be exact ! My travels, since I've been out of school have been great...

Why, THANK YOU for doing that for us

and wow, travel coast to coast, that's so cool! We all have to live with choices and decisions we make in our lives.
Some work out, some don't.

I have no idea how old you are, but my dad was in his early 40s when he got his GED.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

Bert|Evil wrote:
bassist_25 wrote: Don't ever let the "hard work" maxim fool you. Earning wealth has very little to do with "hard work".
Can you explain that in more detail? Wealth, in our otherwise Capitalist economy, has a lot to do with hard work. It may be the hard work of your Great, Great, Great Granddaddy, but it was needed.

OK… SOME wealth happens by accident, such as the wealth obtained by fads. Look at the story behind the Post-It Note.

Two points

1. Wealth is rarely if ever created through earning wages (i.e. money exchanged for labor, or "hard work"), rather it is created through profits (i.e. investing), and to some point, rent. Unless you're a doctor, lawyer, or highly paid entertainer, you are not going to become wealthy through wages. What requires more work: Busting your ass ten hours a day, or putting your money into some blue chip stocks? Obviously, you need the intial capital to invest, but dividend payments can be used to reinvest. If people want to aquire wealth, they are going to have to invest, whether it's in stocks, 401K's, hedge funds, ect.

2. What you are paid is not relative to the amount of "hard work" you put into a job, but whether your skills are in demand. A low demand for your skill coupled with high supply is going to A) Make it a bitch to find a job in the first place B) When you do get that job, your eqilibruim wage is going to be low. It's not relative to the amount of work that goes into a job, unless the amount of work is determining the supply (i.e. the functionlist perspective on why there are few doctors and why their job requires vast amounts of education).

BTW: Before someone starts yelling "Marxist", I'll state once again that I'm a minarchist. Investing's a great thing and people need to sacrifice by going to school to have the skills to enter markets with high demand/low supply. But many people on the right like to appease the working class and lower-middle class with promises of their financial dreams being realized as long as they "work hard". It's a lot more complicated than that.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

ToonaRockGuy wrote:I always read these threads with some humor, as I guess I'm just different from everyone. As long as I make enough money to pay my mortgage, have health coverage, and can have some money to take my kids to the zoo or something, I'm good.

I used to get all pissed off at people who needed status symbols or who had money that they didn't earn, but bitching got me nowhere. I just keep my nose to the grindstone and try to make my family's life as good as I can. I don't really give a crap what other people have, if someone has a million dollar home, good for them. My family is comfortable, I don't stress about the bills too much. That's all I worry about.

It's funny. As a kid, I would look around at my neighbors who were living in bigger homes and driving newer cars than my family. I always thought, "Wow, they must make a lot more money than my mom and dad."

As I got older, I realized that they didn't make more money, they were just deeper in debt.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

Just stopped by from SPL charting these EV sxA360s with the S18/18bx subs. They're too friggin' efficient.

To acquire wealth thru hard work:

1. It must be focused at a reasonable wealth building target.

digging ditches with a shovel is hard work, but it probably won't make you wealthy unless you are lucky enough to find something of value (see lottery).

2. That wealth building target must be YOUR wealth building target.

A hard working employee working for an employer will probably not become wealthy thru their employer, although the employer will probably benefit.

3. You have to hit the target, then focus on a bigger target.

Most people don't achieve wealth because they give up or, at some point, become satisfied with how far they have gotten.

If a person is happy where they are that's great. That's more important than being wealthy. However, if you ask a person with self-made wealth, chances are they'll tell you that it was the struggle that was most satisfying, not the wealth.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

I once seriously dated the daughter of what I consider to be a rich man. He was an architect who designed public buildings like schools. He had a beautiful home in the country that he built with a small hand-picked crew and his family, it had passive solar heating and draft-tower ventilation long before it was accepted, very smart cat, he was.
At any rate, he and I were talking, and I told him I knew I couldn't promise his daughter the kind of monied life she was used to (she didn't care, anyway) and he gave me the best advice I ever got from anyone about anything. I've mentioned it on here before, but I'll do it again, because it's on-topic:
"Don't waste time on money. Don't worry about it, argue about it, dream about it, lay awake over it, or do whatever you have to in order to get it" Here's the bomb: "If you concentrate on being the best at what you do, you will be considered quality. No matter what the economy's like, people will always pay for quality."
It was like a flash of lightning for me, an epiphany. I grew up with nothing and suddenly I realized that "something" is a relative term, and that the pursuit of "stuff" is not the point, and that if "craft" is the objective, as opposed to "stuff," "craft" will get you (you guessed it): "stuff."
Of course, in a capitalist economy, there has to be demand, right? WRONG! If your product is good, and different, you can create demand. How many people knew they needed Post-It's? Zero, until they saw them. until then, you thumbtacked a note to a corkboard. People saw them, said, "Hey, cool," and bought bajillions of them.
So, find something to do, put your heart in it, be good at it, and you can make a living no matter what color, sex or species you are.

Sidebar: The word "Honkey" came up in the late Sixties. Black people think we talk through our noses.------>JMS

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

See Jeff, I knew that we were on the same page about this. You just saw my initial post and thought I was going to spout off about about trust fund babies or something.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

songsmith wrote:I once seriously dated the daughter of what I consider to be a rich man. He was an architect who designed public buildings like schools. He had a beautiful home in the country that he built with a small hand-picked crew and his family, it had passive solar heating and draft-tower ventilation long before it was accepted, very smart cat, he was.
At any rate, he and I were talking, and I told him I knew I couldn't promise his daughter the kind of monied life she was used to (she didn't care, anyway) and he gave me the best advice I ever got from anyone about anything. I've mentioned it on here before, but I'll do it again, because it's on-topic:
"Don't waste time on money. Don't worry about it, argue about it, dream about it, lay awake over it, or do whatever you have to in order to get it" Here's the bomb: "If you concentrate on being the best at what you do, you will be considered quality. No matter what the economy's like, people will always pay for quality."
It was like a flash of lightning for me, an epiphany. I grew up with nothing and suddenly I realized that "something" is a relative term, and that the pursuit of "stuff" is not the point, and that if "craft" is the objective, as opposed to "stuff," "craft" will get you (you guessed it): "stuff."
Of course, in a capitalist economy, there has to be demand, right? WRONG! If your product is good, and different, you can create demand. How many people knew they needed Post-It's? Zero, until they saw them. until then, you thumbtacked a note to a corkboard. People saw them, said, "Hey, cool," and bought bajillions of them.
So, find something to do, put your heart in it, be good at it, and you can make a living no matter what color, sex or species you are.

Sidebar: The word "Honkey" came up in the late Sixties. Black people think we talk through our noses.------>JMS

Johnny, as always, a beautiful post. Everyone who knows me personally, knows that before I decided to pursue my current career, I was an IT professional. IT guys command a pretty respectable salary. I got out of the business for many reasons, but the one main reason was because I knew I would wind up on Prozac by the time I was thirty. All the money in the world couldn't keep me in the IT business. IT guys know what I'm talking about: It's one of the most stressful jobs out there. People can be downright assholes if their computers aren't working, and they don't understand that you can't always trouble-shoot a problem right there at their cubicle. It really made me respect anyone in a public service position. Not that I was disrepectful of people before, but now, even when I go in to pay for my gas, I try to look the cashier in the eye and say thank you (a lot of people don't even do that). But I digress.....

I decided to pursue a career that I knew I would love and would be able to make a respectable wage at. Plus, I'll be helping people. I've never been a materialistic person (though I do want to acquire a small amount of wealth). I want the American Dream as much as anyone else; it's just that I want my version of the American Dream.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

bassist_25 wrote:See Jeff, I knew that we were on the same page about this. You just saw my initial post and thought I was going to spout off about about trust fund babies or something.

Nah, you wouldn't do that. However, I might start in about a conspiracy by old-money families in Blair County to keep major corporations out so that they wouldn't have competition for labor. I've also heard it said that a paranoiac is a person who is aware of what's REALLY going on.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Saturday Jul 23, 2005

lonewolf wrote:I've also heard it said that a paranoiac is a person who is aware of what's REALLY going on.

You listen to Coast to Coast with Art Bell, don't you?

Bert|Evil · Post by **Bert|Evil** » Sunday Jul 24, 2005

Still, it all depends on your definition of hard work!! It could be physical dexterity, but it is usually mental will power and vision. Few incidences of wealth are mistakes (although their stories seem to enlighten us).

I’ve found that the vision of success is simply an equation of wants confused with needs. With Generations X and Y, that can be a very confusing, yet wealth bearing, trade off. Songsmith nailed it with the Post It Note example. People didn’t know that they “needed” it until they created a false “need”. All that from a space age super adhesive that went all wrong at 3M, choir practice, and a light bulb going off. Essentially, it was a mistake that generated an opportunity.

Capitalism gets me erect!!! Socialism is the equivalent of Roseanne Barr naked.

RAM Z · Post by **RAM Z** » Sunday Jul 24, 2005

I agree with ToonaRockGuy! As long as my bills and family are taken care of I'm good! Sorry to say but the world does need ditch diggers too!
I don't have all the smartz that you got Paul ,wish I did though,but any who ,Johnny, Paul, sometimes it takes a different opinion to put things into perspective to really understand how the rest of the world deals with life and you guys always post really interest'n stuff! Thanx !

Like I said, I'm happy with who I am and feel great know'n that my family is happy also! I have worked very hard and have also obtained short term wealth and it has never made me happy just paid the bills! The time I now get to spend with my family is worth more to me than anything in the world! I never wanted long term wealth, though I'm sure it would be nice, I just look at the way people live that have money and I'm sorry but are they truly happy with their lives? Have'n lots of stuff has never made me happy and never will!

BTW, Paul I do have a little something in the investment fund! And I agree, put yer money into something and watch it grow! I sure could use some help on that one though! I just don't understand all of the fancy talk.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Sunday Jul 24, 2005

bassist_25 wrote:
lonewolf wrote:I've also heard it said that a paranoiac is a person who is aware of what's REALLY going on.
You listen to Coast to Coast with Art Bell, don't you?

Never heard of him, but it sounds like maybe I should. I don't pay attention to any talking heads, except that TV background noise helps me sleep, so I put O'Reilly on at 11:00pm. Puts me right to sleep. Fox has plenty of background noise and there is no chance of waking to the rantings of that mullet haired hyperactive speed freak jock selling his exercise equipment on an infomercial at 4am.

YankeeRose · Post by **YankeeRose** » Sunday Jul 24, 2005

lonewolf wrote:....rantings of that mullet haired hyperactive speed freak jock selling his exercise equipment on an infomercial at 4am.

ROFL - I've never seen him longer than 10-15 seconds (Perish the thought!), but that describes him PERFECTLY!

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Sunday Jul 24, 2005

lonewolf wrote:Never heard of him, but it sounds like maybe I should. I don't pay attention to any talking heads, except that TV background noise helps me sleep, so I put O'Reilly on at 11:00pm. Puts me right to sleep. Fox has plenty of background noise and there is no chance of waking to the rantings of that mullet haired hyperactive speed freak jock selling his exercise equipment on an infomercial at 4am.

Oh no, he's not a pundit. He has an AM talk show on Friday and Saturday (and I believe Sunday?) nights/morning. I'm not really sure what time he comes on (I always listen to him on the way home from gigs), but I know that he stays on until five in the morning. Sometimes he'll have another person sitting in, but the show is always known as Coast to Coast. Art's syndicated, and you can find him on a couple of stations. Scan across your stations early in the morning and you'll find him.

It's interesting dicussion about conspiriacy theories and what not. Sometimes he'll have the typical crack-pot "Jesus was really an alien who traveled back from another galaxy" type of people, but more often than not, he'll have some very interesting discourse with reputable academics about genetic engineering, nuclear war, theology, nanotech, ect. Some of it's psuedo/proto-science, but it's all pretty interesting.