~*~Jesus Freaks~*~

[songsmith]

I have to concede that pulling the tube wasn't really the way to go, although, it should be mentioned that all medical authorities not connected to the Schindlers seemed to agree that she was not cognizant of any pain.
Wolf has a very good point, too. It all seemed like far right and far left, and there's no room for moderate thought, which is very unpopular since the polarization of the elections. I said back then that the times they were a-changin'...
Also, a local doctor was asked (off the record) his view on the case. He said that many, if not most, terminal cancer patients would live far, far longer if doctors didn't keep upping the morphine drip towards the end, but suffering would be far worse. Many times, it's not cancer that REALLY brought about the patient's death, it's the slow shutdown of heartbeat and breathing caused by the opiates. Are doctors purposely killing terminal patients? Yes and no. Why? To ease suffering, and God bless them for it. I lost my father to liver cancer, and while he was still coherent, he told me that oncology pain is unlike any other... he wasn't able to be cured, so all that could be done was to ease his suffering. His heart simply slowed to a stop, rather than organ shutdowns, seizures,etc. It happens, and it's sad, but we're mortal, and that's non-negotiable. ----->JMS

[facingwest]

I heard on the radio the most bizarre sickening story today. What was it about?
Well this girl was talking about a serial killer by the name of Steve. Steve apparently abducted her a few years back with the intents to rape, hold hostage for money, then kill. He held her up in her car at the giant eagle...and to make a long story short, he said he was going to kill himself after he killed her....and then she laid her hands on him and prayed for him...and then they went to a secluded area she picked and they talked and everything was okay and he turned himself in and God told her to not be afraid and to help him and this is one large run on sentence.
For me, this made me sick to my stomach because that was the most irational thing to do. Go alone with some psycho who wants to do this to you because God (or the voice in your head?) told you it was good to save this person.
Is it just me or is the the stupidest thing you've ever heard? Does the Divine Being actually want you to put yourself in some possible harm? Or is it all malarky!?

Two words can sum this up. Faith and God's divine power. If this story is what it is, that's what you call a miracle.

[Jim Price]

Several thoughts about the whole Terri Schiavo deal...

First, I agree with Esa. If she was still able to function on her own, keep the feeding tube in. Err on the side of life.

What if next week, medical science made a breakthrough and developed a way to restore brain cells or reverse brain damage? And do we really know just how severely brain damaged Terri Schiavo was? How do we know that she didn't have some capability upstairs to sense or recognize things? She seemed at least conscious and minimally functional in the file footage they kept showing of her - how do we know that she didn't have at least some minimal amount of brain activity?

Although I favored leaving the feeding tube in, I didn't like the idea of the federal government getting involved; it sets a bad precedent. If the government gets involved for the Schiavo case, it opens the door for everybody else with a similar case to go burden the federal government with their situation if they disagree with how the other side of the family or local government is handling it. This case should have remained on the local level, but I would have sided with keeping the feeding tube in.

And what are the implications of this case for severely retarded people with a similar situation? If they're not functional beyond breathing and consciousness, do we pull their feeding tubes as well?

I guess the big lesson learned from all of this - make a will while you are still brain capable so your loved ones know how to handle such a situation should it ever arise...

For the record, if I was brain dead, unconscious and with no hope of recovery, with just the feeding tube and respirator keeping me going, kick out the plug. But if there was any question or even minimal possibility that I might bounce back, allow me the fighting chance to come out of it...

[GUITARII]

I guess the big lesson learned from all of this - make a will while you are still brain capable so your loved ones know how to handle such a situation should it ever arise...

If you do.... make sure you ask for a "living will" to be written up. I recently went through this process and it really is something everyone should do, I learned a lot through this process and am happy to say that my loved ones should not have to worry about making any of these decisions..... Seriously, take the time and get this done!!

"The old preacher can say some words and then chuck me in the clay!!" a small bottle of the pure for the road trip would be nice too!!

[DMFJ03]

I shall say this in true Deathmasterese...

Her family is a walking puss seeping laceration on this earth, and I hope they f**king choke.

Honestly, who would make that big of a deal, publicize the whole thing, and try to play themselves off as innocents? It's disgusting.

If I am ever like that, and they don't pull the plug - I'll haunt everyone's ass who was in the room.

My t-shirts speaks for itself: "Losing faith in humanity one person at a time"

[ain soph aur]

There was a lot more going on behind the scenes here than most people are aware of...

*Terri was not brain-dead as many think, and the "vegetative" state was not a consistent state. She was very able and very much responded POSITIVLY to friends and family... she laughed and smiled all the time. She would cry when you shut off her music. This is far from brain-dead! Furthmore if she was able to show emotion and was as miserable as claimed she was perfectly capable of showing that herself, but instead was usually happy. Also there are a number of accounts of people who in the SAME EXACT state with the RIGHT rehabilitation that learned to walk and talk all over again.

*The husband obtained a court order that resulted in the arrest of anyone who tried to take pictures or video of Terri... he wouldn't want anyone to see this brain-dead vegetable laughing and communicating. Visitors were basically strip searched before entering the room. All the judges who ruled in this case were not allowed to see her in this manner as well.

*Hospice care- the feeding tube was a result of being in Hospice care. Terri was completely capable of swallowing and eating on her own! She was ONLY on a feeding tube because it was CONVIENT for the nurses and the family!

*The poor loyal husband was actually living with another woman and had kids to her. CONFLICT OF INTREST to say the very least! And, the night Terri went into this state the hospital records show that it was violent and most likely due to the result of strangulation. Her body was covered in bruises as well. Only two people were present that night, Terri and her husband. Gee, I wouldn't know why he didn't want her to snap out of it or go into proper rehabilitation! But, these hospital records were also unadmissible in court as well.

*The entire case was centered on Michael honoring the wishes of his wife’s wishes, that Terri has once made the statement once that "she would not want to live like that". First, until now, when people say that they are referring to being completely brain-dead and ONLY being kept alive by artificial means. Second, none of that even matters because Michael slipped up big time on Larry King by saying "We don't know what Terri would have wanted, this is what we want".

So the bottom line here, NO ONE had the right to decide her fate! Not the husband, not the courts, not even the family. But, in our society there is an obligation to take care of her properly with proper medical care (neither of which she received). No matter what anyone says about it in the end that is really what we ALL expect!

This opens the door for so many other things, such as ANYONE with a disability that needs fed, Alzheimer’s patients need fed, INFANTS even need fed... people that starve their children go to jail. My God, people that starve their pets go to jail! Where do we draw the line? OK some those people have a right to life, but the mental retarded don't (keep in mind that is what Terri was... mentally retarded). This is such a disgusting issue to even debate, there simply should just be no question.

The truly ironic thing to all of this is Dr Kevorkian had to rot away in jail because he HUMANLY euthanized people who came to him and without any question WANTED it! But, the courts can order someone to barbarically be starved and torchered to death. What a wonderful time in which we live!

The reason for the government and the courts being involved is a movement to bring euthanasia into law... but ONLY the GOVERNMENT will decide who gets put down. Keep watching people this case sat the precedent… the laws are coming, they are already in the works. Anyone ever seen the movie "Soylent Green"???

[facingwest]

Something else I found out about this at that they sued a hospital or something and there was a settlement. The husband refused to go on with treatment that might help her out with her case. Hearing about the subject makes me sick because how could someone do that to someone they loved?

[ain soph aur]

I think he hated her and she was nothing but a pain in his ass.

[byndrsn]

ain soph aur,

Love your first post!!!

Urbs

[ain soph aur]

Glad to hear it.

If you don't mind me asking... what does "Urbs" mean?