It's time to walk...

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Friday Mar 18, 2005

Ron wrote: Raising the minimum wage makes things worse because then we create more opportunities for companies to save a buck by sending manufacturing out of the country.

Yep, and it can also create a surplus of workers if the price floor falls above equilibrium.............Then again, what's the point of working if your job doesn't even afford you the basics of life?

Ah capitalism, the economic system I both love and hate at the same time.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Friday Mar 18, 2005

Ron wrote:
DMFJ03 wrote:The bottom line is this: Deal with it.

Nothing we do is going to change it, so...just put a sock in your mouth and grab your ankles a little tighter.
It's a good thing that Sam Adams and his cohorts didn't have that attitude about the price of tea in 1773.

True, but I doubt that many people would be willing to boycott gas just because of the price. It kind of reminds me of those chain letters urging people to not buy gas for a day - I just picture a bunch of people at the pumps on the night before thinking, "Yeah man, I'm gonna fill my tank up tonight, but tomorrow I'll really sock it to the man by not purchasing any gas." The only way I could see a fuel boycott having any effect would be if a significant amount of truckers pulled their rigs over and refused to drive until the price came down.

Punkinhead · Post by **Punkinhead** » Friday Mar 18, 2005

If you raise the minimum wage, it gets offset by a raise in inflation. The constant equilibrium that capitalism needs will always stay. Raise wages, raise prices and vice versa.

Although the problem now is that minimum wages haven't gone up since they were set at $5.15 and inflation continues its 2+% rise each year.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Friday Mar 18, 2005

Punkinhead wrote:If you raise the minimum wage, it gets offset by a raise in inflation. The constant equilibrium that capitalism needs will always stay. Raise wages, raise prices and vice versa.

Although the problem now is that minimum wages haven't gone up since they were set at $5.15 and inflation continues its 2+% rise each year.

A forced minimum wage is not an attribute of capitalism. To the free market, it is an artificial price floor on labor costs.

The only way that wages can increase without causing problematic inflation is the introduction of productivity gains into the equation. Unfortunately for labor, too much productivity gain results in a need for less labor. Productivity has been rising a lot faster in recent years, putting a lot of downward pressure on the labor market. Of course, this puts downward pressure on product demand as workers' stagnant wages won't allow them to buy the same level of goods & services. The consumer responds by taking increased debt which puts upward pressure on interest rates (we're there right now). When rates get high enough, it becomes more costly for businesses to invest in new technology to increase productivity, so they turn to labor to meet demand. Armed with new buying power, the consumer pays down debt and buys products with free cash flow. As consumer debt shrinks, this puts downward pressure on interest rates and the whole cycle starts over. Unfortunately, there are a few things going on that doesn't bode well for labor or the economy in general:

1. 30 year treasury bonds issued in the 80s will mature in the 2010s. Every year, hundreds of billions of dollars in treasury money will have to pay the face value as they come due, on top of all the interest it pays now. The national debt will come home to roost.

2. Technology is moving ahead so fast that the free market is having problems integrating it into the system without initially causing adverse effects on the labor force.

The reality of #1 will soon have Americans beating down the doors of Congress, demanding a balanced budget.

JayBird · Post by **JayBird** » Friday Mar 18, 2005

Raising minimum wage only affects those who will make the new minimum wage. Think about it...wages go up...price at McDonald's goes up for a burger. You get a $.25 raise, you have to work four hours to now pay for that burger that has a new price of $1.99 when yesterday it was only $.99. Someone making $50,000 a year isn't gonna notice the $1 increase in that burger. But, the person who just got a raise...they will notice.

esa · Post by **esa** » Saturday Mar 19, 2005

JayBird wrote:Raising minimum wage only affects those who will make the new minimum wage. Think about it...wages go up...price at McDonald's goes up for a burger. You get a $.25 raise, you have to work four hours to now pay for that burger that has a new price of $1.99 when yesterday it was only $.99. Someone making $50,000 a year isn't gonna notice the $1 increase in that burger. But, the person who just got a raise...they will notice.

Hells, I'm still peeved at those bastages. They took the two cheesburgers value meal away. ::sighs::
"Welcome to Mc Donalds, can I take your order?"
"Yeah, I'd like the number two with no cheese on the burgers, coke with out ice and my french fries lightly salted."
::silence::
"Thank you, pull around."
They got to the point of hating me in Cresson for awhile. They never appreciated me when I :
"Welcome to Mc Donalds, can I take your order?"
"No thanks. I'm just here to bullshit. How the hell are you doing today?"
"Um..."

Yeah. I made people in the car snarf that day...

Post by **Ron** » Saturday Mar 19, 2005

McDonald's drive thru order areas once had a sign above the speaker that read "Please mention coupons before ordering".

Worker: "Welcome to Mc Donalds, can I take your order?"
Steve: "How about those coupons?"

I would have snarfed a coke on that one, but we hadn't gotten our food yet.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Saturday Mar 19, 2005

They always seem to ask me if I'd like to try their extra value meal whenever I'm in a drive-through.

JayBird · Post by **JayBird** » Saturday Mar 19, 2005

They still have the two cheeseburger value meal...they just don't list it. Just ask for the two cheeseburger value meal instead of giving a number.

facingwest · Post by **facingwest** » Sunday Mar 20, 2005

I just happened to notice gas went up a little here. It was an average of $2.30 per gallon.

esa · Post by **esa** » Sunday Mar 20, 2005

JayBird wrote:They still have the two cheeseburger value meal...they just don't list it. Just ask for the two cheeseburger value meal instead of giving a number.

dude...you are a godsend!

Jawwge · Post by **Jawwge** » Monday Mar 21, 2005

This has been goin on for 50 years, at least, and for at least as long, the govt has been tryin to fix it with more regulation. More regulation means more govt, more govt means it has to suck more out of the economy to feed itself. So the problem gets worse, and we try to fix it again with more regulation, which means.......................

What's it up to now, somewhere around 50% of all we earn goin to feed this monster? And yas wanna blame it on Bush & SUVs???
]
Rock On!!!

DMFJ03 · Post by **DMFJ03** » Monday Mar 21, 2005

"Welcome to McDonalds, can I take your order?"

Yes, I'd like three cheesburgers, two hamburgers, a coke without ice, a sprite with ice, two large fires, and that will be everything.

"Would you like a hot apple pie?'

Did I ask for an apple pie?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I hate it when they keep trying to sell you things once you have already said "...and that will be everything."

Post by **Jim Price** » Monday Mar 21, 2005

For the past two days, we have been doing the I-95 roadtrip south to our vacation destination in Florida. Gas prices were fairly uniform for the most part. The lowest price I saw was $1.92 a gallon near Brunswick, Georgia; the highest was $2.31 (and the station with that price was empty, there was somebody selling it for $2.09 down the street - that was somewhere in North Carolina). Here in Zephyrhills where we're staying (close to Tampa-St. Pete), the gas prices average $2.05 - $2.09 a gallon, not much worse than home.

I found it interesting that Sheetz was charging $2.05 a gallon in Altoona; the Sheetz stores in Berkeley Springs, WV and Winchester, VA were charging $2.02/2.03 a gallon. Sheetz is gouging their hometown for gas!

For the record, forecast for today is cloudy, a few showers, 84 degrees.

RobTheDrummer · Post by **RobTheDrummer** » Monday Mar 21, 2005

Hey Jim, I don't know what happened...It's sunny skies up here, a dry 90 during the day and a nice 75 at night. I've been out on my motorcycle and no rain!

Why does everyone gotta rub it in when they go to Florida???

Post by **Ron** » Monday Mar 21, 2005

Jim,
Sheetz is actually giving us in Pa. a better deal on the gas once you subtract our high state gas tax.

Post by **Jim Price** » Monday Mar 21, 2005

One other thing about this part of Florida...we have lots of geckos populating the area. (These are the little salamander-like lizards that sell car insurance on TV.) Even had a tiny one crawling on our carpet inside the door earlier this morning, I thought it was a cricket at first.

facingwest · Post by **facingwest** » Monday Mar 21, 2005

Stop in and visit JP!! You're already 2/3 the way here.

Imgrimm01 · Post by **Imgrimm01** » Monday Mar 21, 2005

I don't know why gas is high but what I do know is our government will take care of it ! I trust them TOTALLY and COMPLETELY !! Our president and his staff will always look out for us, even if it costs them money. I trust EVERYTHING about the U.S. Government.

esa · Post by **esa** » Tuesday Mar 22, 2005

::just shakes her head and pokes you:: Some day, Bobby Lee, I'm going to open up the paper and read! Yes! I will read!
Er...
Well, I will read about how this little place was bought by some guy...and he put a wall around it...and a moat! (every good sovereign nation needs a moat! and a crocodile...named Filbert)...and declared it Bobby Lee Land. All wall paper will be anti bush...hell, even the pancakes will have GW's face with a pancaked "red" line through it...

On the Jeff Foxworthy roast...they had a good GW impersonator there...

Punkinhead · Post by **Punkinhead** » Tuesday Mar 22, 2005

My family has taken measures to save gas and money. We know walk to anything within 1-2 miles and bike it if its around 3-4. I also plan on getting a motorcycle. Shopping has been cut down to once a week. Going out, barely ever, etc. Doing all this can save us $30-$40 a week in gas. Take that times 52 and you have $1500-$2000 a year. Of course none of this would have to happen if gas wasn't as high as it is but, it is and the only things we can do is not do as much....

I also plan on getting an oil, garbage, electric hybrid once I'm out of school. Designs are finished for a car that will get 300 miles to a gallon by use of electricity, burning oil, and burning a third substance (forgot what it was but, it's some kind of junk something).

Truthfully I've had my fill of this situation. Fuck oil, fuck the middle east, and fuck our government for sitting on their fat greedy asses and doing nothing.

Mo Lester · Post by **Mo Lester** » Tuesday Mar 22, 2005

JP, Bring me home a gecko!

JayBird · Post by **JayBird** » Tuesday Mar 22, 2005

Maybe we need another government to govern our government! Yeah more government...that should fix everything.

Actually what we need is no government, no f'en taxes, and a judicial system that will kill someone on deathrow tomorrow and not wait 25 years later.

Post by **Ron** » Tuesday Mar 22, 2005

Punkinhead wrote:I also plan on getting an oil, garbage, electric hybrid once I'm out of school. Designs are finished for a car that will get 300 miles to a gallon by use of electricity, burning oil, and burning a third substance (forgot what it was but, it's some kind of junk something)

I know someone who has an old diesel truck that he runs on leftover cooking oil from the cafeteria at the place he works. The exhaust smells like McDonalds.

And there's always this alternative...the hempmobile.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Tuesday Mar 22, 2005

I guess I have some unpopular opinions. And I'd like to keep them. I'd even like to say them right out loud. Because if I just sit here and spout Bush Administration-approved talking points, that is not freedom or entertainment. It's Fox News!

Oh, I don't know about unpopular opinions Bobby Lee. I trust the government as much as you do (lol), probably even more (lol)! The only difference with me is that I trust (lol) the government, no matter who the president is.

In reality, the federal government is not capable of doing anything except:

1. Collecting ridiculous amounts of taxes
2. Spending our tax money obsessively, compulsively and inefficiently.
3. Blowing things up and killing people.

#1 & 2 should be limited to #3.

ROCKPAGE

It's time to walk...

Re: gas

i DON'T KNOW