Drum solos - Good ? Bad ? Opinions ?

[Hawk]

I stated this in another thread, but I really am curious what everyone thinks.

I'm curious what drummers, other musicians and non musicians think of drum solos ? Back when I did prog rock it was expected. The band I'm in now, it seems a drum solo is a bit out of place.

I would think that in general, they can be a bit boring to anyone but other drummers. I know a couple of very good local drummers who prefer not to play a solo for this reason.

There are two types of drum solos as well. One that keeps a groove/rhythm going that is danceable and one that is not danceable but more detailed in it's form.

Any thoughts ? Like 'em...Don't like 'em ?

[f.sciarrillo]

I like them, Bill.

[Gallowglass]

I answered this on the other thread, but it's probably more appropriate here so I'm copying & pasting my other response here:

I love 'em! I prefer mostly the more detailed form with maybe a little bit of groove thrown in to break it up. I'm not as big a fan of pure groove solos because hopefully that is already what the drummer is doing all night behind the songs.

You always say that in the band that you're in now that drum solos are a bit out of place...why? Have you actually had negative feedback?

[sstuckey]

I love em if they have flare. I've never done a drum solo (live anyway) but one was never requested either. So I'm going to assume as you said the average listener thinks its a snooze fest, but other drummers will more than likely enjoy and be more impressed.
People typically go to clubs to see bands for a couple reasons. Girls like to dance, and shake 'dat ass' and drink free alcohol. Guys go because well there's drunk girls shakin dat ass! lol Drum solos don't typically inspire ass shakin and is probably WAY more appreciated by musicians than your average partier.

[lynch1]

I like em. I have the utmost respect for drummers, I can't get all 4 limbs doing 4 different things. I jumped behind a kit a couple times just for kicks and went "what the ....., how do you guys do this?" I like drum solos from a good drummer. Saw Sully and Shannon? from Godsmack do a drum duel in concert, it was awesome. Watched a drum solo from Tommy Lee on TV that was great too. I'm a guitar player, but I usually end up befriending the drummer out of everyone in the band the most.

[Hawk]

I answered this on the other thread, but it's probably more appropriate here so I'm copying & pasting my other response here:

I love 'em! I prefer mostly the more detailed form with maybe a little bit of groove thrown in to break it up. I'm not as big a fan of pure groove solos because hopefully that is already what the drummer is doing all night behind the songs.

You always say that in the band that you're in now that drum solos are a bit out of place...why? Have you actually had negative feedback?

Never had any negative feed back but I only ever did the one solo (other than a couple of unprepared short ones). I don't know of any blues drummers that solo during a gig, other than a short groove solo. But I have great respect for the two drummers I mentioned, who I'm sure could play a kick ass solo, but are afraid they'd bore the crowd. That is what inspired me to start this thread. To get feedback from everyone.

[RobTheDrummer]

There's a time and place for them. We used to do one in the middle of a certain tune. Some nights I didn't do it depending on the feel of the crowd. Bill, you could always write a tune that's like playing a drum solo! But then some people would say you are over playing!

[ToonaRockGuy]

Drum solos are a good thing and a bad thing. Whether or not to do a solo depends on the type of gig, the crowd, and most importantly, your comfort level with it.

If you sit down in "the woodshed" and come up with the mother of all solos that you know is going to leave everyone's mouth agape, and that it's so good that every drummer in the state is going to worship you....don't play it. Odds are it's way too long, way too technical, and has no soul to it.

The bummer about playing a drum solo is that you need to play for the lowest common denominator, the crowd. They don't care if you can play a quadruple paradidle ostinato with your feet in 11, while your hands play in five at 200bpm. They want to hear the quad roll between the kicks and the toms. They want to clap along. The reason that the Godsmack solo between Sully Erna and Shannon Larkin is so damned effective is that it is simple, it grooves like hell, and it involves the crowd.

Here's the solo if you haven't seen it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvjuG_jMF6I

Say what you want about Godsmack's music, but they are still playing to 10,000 people a night, while we are playing for 50.

For the same reasons, I prefer listening to Benny Greb rather than Thomas Lang. If you pull up solos on YouTube, Lang shows amazing chops, I'm not downing the guy...but he just cannot groove. Benny Greb has every bit the chops that Lang does, and all his solo work is built around groove. As a drummer, I think they are equal. As a fan, I'd rather listen to Greb, he involves me more.

A good rock drum solo usually contains a few tantamount elements: "call and response" (usually the feet repeating what the hands play), a few snare rudiments, demonstrations of a few grooves, the quad roll or triplet roll, and the "huge build ending". Is it interesting to you? Not really. But the crowd will eat it up. Sometimes you need to take into consideration what the crowd wants, and not what you want as a drummer.

Just my .02.

[Banned]

Some of my favorite bands, Led Zep and The Allman Brothers have songs with drum solos. I love them.

I saw Matt Abts from Government Mule, and wow, could that guy solo.

I did like your solo Bill. I also like it when you do something out of the ordinary in a song, how you change it up during a chord change. That kind of stuff.

[Hawk]

Drum solos are a good thing and a bad thing. Whether or not to do a solo depends on the type of gig, the crowd, and most importantly, your comfort level with it.

If you sit down in "the woodshed" and come up with the mother of all solos that you know is going to leave everyone's mouth agape, and that it's so good that every drummer in the state is going to worship you....don't play it. Odds are it's way too long, way too technical, and has no soul to it.

The bummer about playing a drum solo is that you need to play for the lowest common denominator, the crowd. They don't care if you can play a quadruple paradidle ostinato with your feet in 11, while your hands play in five at 200bpm. They want to hear the quad roll between the kicks and the toms. They want to clap along. The reason that the Godsmack solo between Sully Erna and Shannon Larkin is so damned effective is that it is simple, it grooves like hell, and it involves the crowd.

Here's the solo if you haven't seen it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvjuG_jMF6I

Say what you want about Godsmack's music, but they are still playing to 10,000 people a night, while we are playing for 50.

For the same reasons, I prefer listening to Benny Greb rather than Thomas Lang. If you pull up solos on YouTube, Lang shows amazing chops, I'm not downing the guy...but he just cannot groove. Benny Greb has every bit the chops that Lang does, and all his solo work is built around groove. As a drummer, I think they are equal. As a fan, I'd rather listen to Greb, he involves me more.

A good rock drum solo usually contains a few tantamount elements: "call and response" (usually the feet repeating what the hands play), a few snare rudiments, demonstrations of a few grooves, the quad roll or triplet roll, and the "huge build ending". Is it interesting to you? Not really. But the crowd will eat it up. Sometimes you need to take into consideration what the crowd wants, and not what you want as a drummer.

Just my .02.

Well said Kevin.

[Hawk]

There's a time and place for them. We used to do one in the middle of a certain tune. Some nights I didn't do it depending on the feel of the crowd. Bill, you could always write a tune that's like playing a drum solo! But then some people would say you are over playing!

I love to over play. Actually that's a discussion Shawn and I used to have when he was playing "pop". How to overplay and not sound like you're over playing. The fills have to be sneaked in so as not to draw attention, and they have to be tasteful and dynamically well controlled.

I remember seeing a local band and talking to the guitar player (who I respect) and he was so happy with his drummer because the drummer played every song exactly the same every time. I think he might throw me out because I can't do that, unless it's specifically called for.

[VENTGtr]

I love to over play. Actually that's a discussion Shawn and I used to have when he was playing "pop". How to overplay and not sound like you're over playing. The fills have to be sneaked in so as not to draw attention, and they have to be tasteful and dynamically well controlled.

See, I don't necessarily consider that overplaying. If what you're doing works for the song, and it's what you want to hear in it, it's just using ability to contribute, maybe add something more interesting compositionally.

When it's pointless, hurts the song, or is there just to show you can do it, it's overplaying.

Solos...live...doesn't matter what instrument...nope. Boring. Use that time to play a few more songs. Get yer jollies in the basement.

My one caveat to that might be Peart's drum solo. He always added stuff that made it interesting to average concert-goers. But, even then...

[lonewolf]

{copied from the Peart on Letterman thread}

Hell yeah. Just try to keep it under an hour, LOL.

They are absolutely useful in your latest genre too Bill. I have seen videos of jazz/blues bands where the drummer keeps the groove up, but also goes wild....same with the big bands from the 30s & 40s. These solos generally didn't last very long, maybe a minute or so, but they were very effective. Also, unlike most rock solos, they never skipped a beat in the song.

[bassist_25]

If they're musical and tasteful, then they can add to a song. If they're an excercise in how many paradiddles the drummer knows and drag on for 23 minutes, then no thanks.

It's the same with bass solos: If they are musical, have a clear melody, and take the song somewhere interesting, then they're awesome. If they're a showcase for how fast the player can double-thump and two-hand tap, then nix 'em.

[Hawk]

When I saw Thomas Lang at a clinic (He is the most technically advanced drummer I have ever seem / heard in my life, and I've seen some great ones) he said, "This is fun for us drummers, but don't ever do this for an audition because you won't get the gig".

[Banned]

A drum solo is awesome during your gig but the timing must be right. My thoughts, generally latish hour toward the latter 1/3 of yur show after you nailed it with 3 or 4 h.u.g.e. dance set tunes in a row. Let them sit down for a breather and a another drink then let your drummer amze them. Or your bass. god i love a great bass!

my thoughts are your gigs have 2 purpose, entertaining the fans but just as importantly entertaining YOU (as the musician) . You just don't play for the $, that's not why you play, that's not the only reason. You play for YOU too. Both have to work.

my thoughts are EACH musician should get to shine STRUT HIS STUFF at some strategic point during the show (lead guitar, bass, drummer).

it's been about the LEAD all night, (the guy standing point)they get too much credit sometimes. (have you noticed that convention dictates that sows have a geometry to them, ie all in a triangle formation?)

Personally, as a fan, i love solo's. Don't have to do a strait solo (you can but don't have to) but pick a tune that emphasizes a particular instrument. As a fan i love to see the spotlight turn to the drummer or bass player or lead guitar. As a fan i appreciate the talent, the speed, the nuance, the intensity even if i can't define all the elements into muscical theaory.

so yes, i'd love to see more bands emphasize more the INDIVIDUALS that make up their collective talent. first and foremost, what do they want to dance to, but at right time please DAZZLE US with your individual talent!

[Jasaoke]

I am not a drummer but I don't really care for any single-instrument showcases. I like texture and instrumentation; the sound a whole (or parts of a) group makes.

I agree that most of the people they impress are other musicians, but that can be accomplished through ensemble playing as well.

Think of it like this: If I do a solo (and make worth anybody's time) I pretty much have to empty my bag of tricks. But if I simply pull out those tricks at strategic places in the show, I don't have to give it all up but still hold people's attention.

[Hawk]

I really appreciate every-one's opinion so far, thanks.

More insight / thoughts ?