Fan support in State College

[Blue Reality]

Disclaimer: This is a bit of a vent along with a search for feed back...


Chuck Mason and Blue Reality are playing at Cafe 210 in S.C. on Friday. It's hard to find support here in town. I'd love to play here. Who doesn't want to play in their back yard? But finding people in this area who will come out to enjoy a night of electric blues with Cream, Hendrix and the like on a regular basis is getting harder and harder. Building an audience here in SC is hard if you aren't playing party rock. Yeah I know its hard everywhere but SC has its own built in stupidity.

I know we have to travel and we're willing to do it. We have the chops musically. We were selected for the same blues challenge Felix and the 'Canes won. But we need to gig far more than we are.

I almost feel like we need to forget about SC and focus outside of the area. We're hitting open mikes, partnering with bands like Mystery Train at their Spring Fling, some really cool stuff. I just think twice when I find myself writing off SC. But some times reality is what it is.....

Feedback is appreciated....

[Big-H]

alot of bands have a hard time gettin in there.most bands that are htere have been there.for years..and ur right it has to be a party band..ur gonna have to load up ur bus and bring em urself!!:)

[nakedtwister]

We know how you feel. It has taken us 2 years to get some what of a following in Altoona and it's only at some of the bars. People don't want to venture too far anymore. Some people just don't understand what the Blues are about. They think it's a bunch of depressing BS not realizing that it's actually uplifting. We try to select songs that are powerful and uplifting and send a message. And just rock the #$%@ out in a Blues manner. It does take time, but if you do it right the will come. The fan base we have are very appreciative of what we do and we love them for it because we love the Blues. Playing with great bands such as Mystery Train is a big help too. Thanks to the 'Canes, on a few occasions, for giving up stage time, we got a good start. Don't get discouraged. We need more Blues Bros. out there. Good Luck to you all.




Brian
The Hawks Blues Band

[GoneForever]

Maybe there's not much of a blues scene in State College.

[Blue Reality]

A zero blues scene here. Which is why we play a lot of hendrix, Cream led Zep and mix the blues in from there. I'm "discouraged" not in general, but because I really can't play in my own back yard. If the Hawks have a tough time building in their backyard in Altoona, how 'bout a band from SC that has few connections at all in Altoona? I know my friends from here ain't gonna drive to see us there.

It is what it is. We're just gonna have to work a bit differently. No sense wasting time in a market that won't support your music.

We need to stick together. Maybe do a night of blues in club in Altoona with a bunch of bands, same lineup in SC, Lewstown. we might not make a bunch if money, but clubs might do a night of blues as a special event, and we could help each other out with exposure and the like.

[JackANSI]

You gotta think, these are college kids, they grew up in an entirely different musical landscape...

Not everyone thinks oldies are goodies. Your target audience is much older than college age and if you are targeting college age kids, you're probably going to be limited to the group that likes jam music. (so you're going in the right direction with Mystery Train).


You'd be hard pressed to find the attention span in SC to sit and listen to some of those loooong older songs. Remember, they were probably BORN in 1989-1991. Heck their parents could have conceived them to the brand new album from Nirvana called Nevermind...

[Blue Reality]

I teach guitar and almost ALL of my students want to learn Cream, Hendrix, G&R, Van Halen. There are a lot of college students who want to hear what we play. The problem is you can't get enough consistant time in clubs to build the following. If you don't show up with a built in crowd, you don't get a second chance. Years ago you had the Brick house, Scorpion, Stoneys for mid week gigs and you could build it. Not now....

[witchhunt]

Yeah I know its hard everywhere but SC has its own built in stupidity.

Odd thing to say if you're looking for fans.

[JackANSI]

Of course those who want to learn guitar are going to like that music, its the defacto standard in guitar... but not everyone wants to learn guitar; there are many more who don't, than do.

If your crowd is musicians who like that stuff, eventually they will all catch their own gigs (and struggle along) and won't be free to come to yours

In SC, a party band makes money for the clubs, much like a DJ does. Bars want people who drink alot (party people), people who have responsibilities (debatably older or of higher taste), usually drink responsibly.

[Lisa]

I think you need to look outside the box. Don't go for the venues that attract the students. There are a lot of clubs in SC that have the non-student population. Also, maybe think of a venue that may not normally have a band that may be interested in trying something new.

Also, when you think of SC, you have to consider the Bellefonte area. Between the two towns, there are plenty of clubs.

I personally love the blues. Nothing like good blues and jazz. But, I don't think it is such a hit in Houtzdale. When I get rich, I'm gonna have me some blues bands and some jazz bands play....lol.

[JackANSI]

Well there is that... Like Lisa said you could try outside the box... Maybe the 4-8pm happy hour/dinner crowd would like what you got more. (More than the kids who want to throw themselves around to really upbeat/faster tempo stuff and get wasted, anyway..)

[Ron]

Losing the Brickhouse, Scorpion and Stoneys was definitely a blow. The biggest blow to blues in SC was probably Tanya Browne's death in 2001.

Xenos occasionally has some blues bands, and since JR bought Cafe 210, I have seen more blues leaning things happening there, like Justin Earle several weeks back (fantastic show).

Hearing those same hashed-over, beat-to-death tunes played by every 'party band' is simply disappointing.

[Hawk]

The Hawks (because of our former bassist, Harry) decided to go straight up blues. We don't have a large following but we want to be different than most bands out there. We find we do best in small venues where we're close to the people, rather than big rooms with a stage.

It seems we can build a following at each venue, but they don't travel well to other venues. We knew there would be problems like that when we started. The "blues" is not an easy sell. But because we love what we do, it's catching on at some places.

We had patients because we knew we'd occasionally play to table and chairs until we found our niche. Gradually we're finding our place.

The Hurricanes have helped us as well. They are a great blues band, but they can play a thousand songs so they can play to the crowd, from classic rock to new stuff to blues.

We are loving the blues and we'll play it until no one wants us. Fortunately, young and old alike are coming out to hear us. But the general public needs to be educated as to what the blues is. As nakedtwister alluded to, the very term "blues" seems to have a negative connotation. Some kind of music that's boring and will put people to sleep. Nothing is further from the truth.

I remember our first gig was a benefit with some metal bands. Many people (musicians and non musicians) were saying things like, "I'm not into the blues, but you guys are good". Or, "I never heard most of those songs, good stuff", while shaking my hand.

Sorry for rambling on. I wish you the best of luck and be patient, until people actually know what you're about and what the blues is about.

[Blue Reality]

Ok....

My point about guitar students is not to say that everyone wants to hear classic rock or blues, but that there are more than enough PSU students who want to hear it to make a band such as mine viable. Frankly I meet a ton of students who think party bands suck. There are more students who enjoy modern music and thus its easier for bars to get a party style band and crowd. The bar owners in SC are about maximizing profit. In the past the formers owners had more respect for the music. Rarely anymore. That's why they recycle bands and band members and have little patience for a band to build anything outside of the party band box. I've palyed Zeno's, the Brewery, Cafe 210 and have a hell of a reputation in this town as a musician and guitar player. Every reply I get when I bring a new project to them is..... The music is phenominal, have our set line up. No thanks The Tripple A Blues Band owns the friday evening slot at zeno's. It will only become available when Andy Tolins moves away......

Thus the inherent stupidity. That line was not about fans, but about the fact that all they are doing is drawing revenue off of one narrow style of music. The Saloon has their line up painted on their building. I don't have a problem with it, but call it what it is. It is not a working music scene as we might think of it. Put it this way. I saw Queen Bee the year they got started playing the Brickhouse, Cafe 210, et al. i don't think they would stand a chance given their starting point in the current Sc market.

And Lisa, there actually aren't that many places to play between here and Bellefonte. And the numbers are shrinking all the time. One of the biggest band venues Pleasant Gap will shut down when the right business opportunity presents itself. They have been looking for years.

JR at the Cafe is trying to do bands such as ours for post college crowd earlier in the evening. That's the slot we are playing. i give him grreat props for that. But if we don't draw well we won't be back. I'm cool with that. It's the way the system works.

I'm just facing reality here to say, I'm better off calling it what it is and looking else where. it just suck when your back yard is so musically focused on one genre.

[VENTGtr]

Every reply I get when I bring a new project to them is..... The music is phenominal, have our set line up. No thanks

There's the problem. SC has always had the vertical booking, but in the past, you could be sure whomever was playing someplace was good. Now, often it seems like it's just that they were convenient. always, of course. There are still great bands around, but not as consistently really good, as in the past. Also, used to be you could go anyplace any day of the week to see bands there. Not the case any more. Sad.

The Tripple A Blues Band owns the friday evening slot at zeno's. It will only become Te favailable when Andy Tolins moves away......

Ya, Zeno's would probably be your best bet...Not sure who is there after Trip A nowadays.

Have you looked into doing an acoustic version of things at Otto's?

[tornandfrayed]

I guess that is part of why they are the Blues.

This type of music will never draw like Nickelback. It is the nature of a Howlin Wolf or a Robert Johnson to be on the outside lookin in.

I say write about it and play where you can.

You guys are young, go on the road and see what you can do just living day to day and playing to eat...

Then bring it back home and write about it some more..

[Blue Reality]

yeah playing blues is tough and I don't have any illusions about that. With technology, the economy, an aging audienc, and a host of other factors, the game has changed and it's time to adapt. Part of that involves recognizing SC for what it is and move on. I have a few gigs here and we'll give them the effort the required to be successful. But the old model isn't working here. And for the most part won't. So to infinity and beyond.

Do the Hawks or any other blues oriented band want to put together a night of Blues somewhere. Maybe 2-3 bands figure out a show and take that out to places like SC, Lewistown, Altoona, Williamsport? Probably won't make a lot of money, but we can create some exposure. JR at the Cafe might be interested in a one night event. Anyone interested?

[felix'apprentice]

Do the Hawks or any other blues oriented band want to put together a night of Blues somewhere. Maybe 2-3 bands figure out a show and take that out to places like SC, Lewistown, Altoona, Williamsport? Probably won't make a lot of money, but we can create some exposure. JR at the Cafe might be interested in a one night event. Anyone interested?

i was goin to suggest something to that sort. that'd be freakin awesome. we need to show people the blues arent boring! it frustrates me when people say oh well that band plays the blues, i dont wanna see them.

i love the blues - and big props to the hawks for helpin me love it even more with the blues jams!

- kayla.

[gibson980]

My band plays up there a good bit. We play mostly modern rock. We do well but as far as actually making fans, its a lost cause.

The students are only there for a couple things. Most of the students that come to live band bars absolutely hate dance clubs (that's where you'll find 80% of the students anymore).

When they do come to hear a band its to hear tom petty, the gin blossoms, BON JOVI, and other out-played worthless music. Typically your 80's covers.

I realized for the most part that the students don't give a rats ass who is playing. The dudes have one thing on their mind and that is getting vagina. If they can't get that, then they get drunk. The girls could honestly care less and most of the time are just getting drunk and carrying on a convo with their friends.

My band is one of the only bands that plays in state that has a different set list than everyone. For the most part, all the bands I heard, you can honestly interchange their set lists, it is that pathetic.

My overall point is, no matter who is there, the students could care less. They have more things on their minds. Its pretty said when you think their is 40k people there.

[JackANSI]

Ok....

My point about guitar students is not to say that everyone wants to hear classic rock or blues, but that there are more than enough PSU students who want to hear it to make a band such as mine viable. Frankly I meet a ton of students who think party bands suck. There are more students who enjoy modern music and thus its easier for bars to get a party style band and crowd. The bar owners in SC are about maximizing profit. In the past the formers owners had more respect for the music. Rarely anymore. That's why they recycle bands and band members and have little patience for a band to build anything outside of the party band box. I've palyed Zeno's, the Brewery, Cafe 210 and have a hell of a reputation in this town as a musician and guitar player. Every reply I get when I bring a new project to them is..... The music is phenominal, have our set line up. No thanks The Tripple A Blues Band owns the friday evening slot at zeno's. It will only become available when Andy Tolins moves away......

Thus the inherent stupidity. That line was not about fans, but about the fact that all they are doing is drawing revenue off of one narrow style of music. The Saloon has their line up painted on their building. I don't have a problem with it, but call it what it is. It is not a working music scene as we might think of it. Put it this way. I saw Queen Bee the year they got started playing the Brickhouse, Cafe 210, et al. i don't think they would stand a chance given their starting point in the current Sc market.

And Lisa, there actually aren't that many places to play between here and Bellefonte. And the numbers are shrinking all the time. One of the biggest band venues Pleasant Gap will shut down when the right business opportunity presents itself. They have been looking for years.

JR at the Cafe is trying to do bands such as ours for post college crowd earlier in the evening. That's the slot we are playing. i give him grreat props for that. But if we don't draw well we won't be back. I'm cool with that. It's the way the system works.

I'm just facing reality here to say, I'm better off calling it what it is and looking else where. it just suck when your back yard is so musically focused on one genre.

Sounds like you are thinking/hoping/wishing the 21-24 year old bar-going crowd in a college town wants to go out after a week of doing boring school work to watch you play blues.

What they probably want is to escape the mind numbing work they are trudging through (so they can get on with their lives), and release pent up energy that has no where else to go since they just spent a week sitting behind a table doing school work. (and they want to party/hang out with their friends since they might have been working too hard to do that during the week)

A party band or DJ takes them to that release and really quick. Sitting behind a table (again) watching older guys play the blues probably won't have the same effect. They go out to a bar to lift their spirits, hang out with friends, and maybe get laid. Not to watch a band... (unless said band has girls up and shaking their booty)

Granted, they may like the music, but chances are they would rather sit behind a table and do school work while listening to said music (instead of going to a bar and PAY to do the same thing). Or, in this case, stay home and practice said music on their guitar so they can get the most out of the lessons they are taking...

You could always tell your guitar students that they have to come 'sit in' with your band once a week... Then you created your built-in crowd.

The best thing you can do to get people to come in the door and witness the greatness-that-is-your-band is... no cover, popular drink specials, and most importantly, give them a good time so they come back with friends.


rant-on:
I still don't know why bar owners think a cover is a good idea when increasingly people have less to spend when they go out. Especially bars that allow smoking. The patrons usually buy a pack of smokes before going out, then have to pay just about that much again on the cover, for the privilege of overpaying dearly on beer and alcohol.

So a smoker is probably looking at $10 minimum just to get to (and in) a smoking bar. $5-$10 more (assuming they would rather party with the "Captain", than the "Admiral") and they could have a whole fifth to themselves instead of paying 7-10 times that for Bankers Club, getting it one shot at time at a bar. (and if they stay in, they don't have to risk the thousands of dollars a DUI would take from them).

Yes I know a stiff cover might keep people there, since they don't want to pay ANOTHER cover to go somewhere else. But you're going to exclude people that otherwise might take a chance on your bar with that same cover.

[RobTheDrummer]

I agree with Gibson. It's all about the student population that is made up of young kids that wanna get pussy. DJ's and pop music bands get the pussy out. When was the last time you went and seen a lot of pussy go out to see a blues band? I wish it weren't the case, because I love me some blues, but it's just a fact. Why do you think a lot of times DJs are so popular? The younger crowd has grown up more with hip hop than before, and girls wanna go shake their ass. The guys follow it, well because of hormones. A lot of guys don't even give two fucks about DJs or bands, they just want the goods.

[Blue Reality]

Edited

[Blue Reality]

Hey Jack, you're trolling now. I've never said that I want to kids to like blues. There are people in the community and the university who would like to hear the music. The audience is there. The Tripple A blues band packs Zeno's time they play. It's a mixed audience age wise. Zeno's has blue grass mid week with Andy. These audiences are there on at least some vialbe level. You can't build it becuase you don't have the opportunity to play with enough frequency and predictability. So Jack itroll on if you must.

And Rob you are right on one level. Guys want to drink and party. Not eveyone here does. There are a lot of people who have different goals about music. But have given up that any downtown club will offer anything but the same old rehash. They don't go anywhere. Period

Club onwers here tell the same thing all the time. They want to increase their market in the 30+ age range. Hardly anyone in that range heads dowtwon because they don't want to deal with the party band scene.

You can turn this into what you want. My point remains the same. SC is wack by and large part because of the current system in place and I'm going to have to look elswhere.

[Scott Walk]

I remember being in a cover band back in the day when Classic attitudes first opened up. What an eye-opener that was. They seen an opportunity and took it.Many bands went to having really good crowds, to barely being able to pay for production. Times they were a changin' and in a big way.

[Blue Reality]

I agree with you. Things are very different and its not just with the SC party band thing.