Has anyone been bumped at The Bunker?

[dakotarose]

Grrrr...

I received a phone call from someone at The Bunker today letting me know we have been bumped this Saturday because the owner's band decided to play this weekend (I won't mention names....) This is the second time this has happened! I know that it is not Melia's fault (she books the bands). Melia is a lovely person and works hard to establish good working relationships with bands. Considering that the owner is a musician, you would think he would be more considerate of other people's time and efforts!

Has anyone else had this experience?

[Mysterytrain]

We just lost Jan 2 and Jan 30 at the Roadhouse.

As a band it seems we try to be reasonable with club owners. Whether that's schedule changes, little or no pay at times when it snows and/or no one shows up. Meanwhile it seems we are the first to get fucked when it all comes down to it.

Rarely do we get a call about canceling. They just seem to "forget" to contact us.

What really is a kick in the fuckin' ass is when they book us and then later on book another band with a bigger draw. Like we don't have a schedule to keep filled. Basically, they booked us UNTIL something better comes along.

Anyway... that's my rant.

Sorry you lost your gig.

[RamRod 1]

Dear beloved "Dickie", some 40 odd years ago you chose to become a "musician. You also once chose to become a marine, one of the toughest lifestyles there is. Shouldn't the life of a Marine be tough enough? This playing shit gets rediculous sometimes. The guy at the Bunker is wrong! Definately wrong. A deal is a deal.

If you make a deal to play at a place on a certain date, that means that you ain't gonna be playing any place else on that night and if he cancels you, that means that the band ain't making any money. If you would have booked another place, you'd be making money. Sounds to me like the guy is a dishonorable selfish bastard.

Excuse me for maybe being a bit harsh, but I've been brunt too and I'm sure we're not alone.

[dakotarose]

LOL....this is Laura, Dakota Rose's singer ...

[JayBird]

Contracts kiddies! Verbal agreements mean nothing in today's struggling music market. It used to be as simple as a handshake and a verbal confirmation. Hell, contracts really mean nothing if you aren't going to take legal action. Put a 2-3 week cancellation clause in your contract. You have the right within that time frame and the venue also has the right within that time to cancel. Any sooner, then both parties can be held to contract terms financially.

[4_the_pocket]

Contracts kiddies! Verbal agreements mean nothing in today's struggling music market. It used to be as simple as a handshake and a verbal confirmation. Hell, contracts really mean nothing if you aren't going to take legal action. Put a 2-3 week cancellation clause in your contract. You have the right within that time frame and the venue also has the right within that time to cancel. Any sooner, then both parties can be held to contract terms financially.

Contracts? Hah! Good luck with that in this area...and is it really necessary? In addition, are those legal fees to take it to court worth the pittance you lost out on in the first place?

Most bands in the area do rely on a handshake and a verbal. Youre really only as good as your word around here in my honest opinion. Obviously, this guy is not good for his word.

You probably only have 3 choices:

1. Contact the owner (not the person who booked you) and have a civil, adult and business-like conversation explaining how his selfish decision cost you. And ask what is he prepared to do to make it right or whole. Be prepared for a negative or unsatisfactory result, but you may get a pleasant surprise.

2. Take the "screw me once, shame on you...screw me twice, shame on me approach" play the club again and take your chances.

3. This is the hard pill to swallow (especially for a band who just really wants to play some clubs and fill their calender), but stand on principle and cancel any other shows you have there. This will probably hurt you more than them, but youve still got your pride and principles. You can then discretely put the word out to others what the deal is in that place.

The whole situation sucks and Im sorry its happened. Its probably happened to all of us and we move on.

[moxham123]

Oh, yeah, it happened to us at The Bunker Inn a couple times since the manager position changes there often. Each time, there was a different story. We always drew a good crowd there too but that did not matter. The last time it happened to us there, I opened the newspaper and saw there was no ad for us a couple days before the gig. I called and the bartender knew nothing. She called the manager who told her to tell me that John claimed he called me and cancelled us. Nobody ever called me.

There are other places that pull the same stuff and it recently happened to us twice at another place in the Johnstown area on short notice when it was too late to book another place. The first time in October, they used the famous pass the buck and somebody double booked the date. However, the guy they claim double booked is the guy I booked with and I said then they should cancel the last band booked since we were booked first. I reconfirmed our December date and one of the owners said they would make it up to us and book us more in 2010. Well, they ended up cancelling our December date and I turned down an offer to open for a national act at a concert that I could not get then. I asked them if they would like it if we cancelled on them for another place and they said no. This is a place that we drew a very good crowd since we promoted the place even though both times we played there they did not advertise at all and then they blamed the newspaper.

[bassist_25]

3. This is the hard pill to swallow (especially for a band who just really wants to play some clubs and fill their calender), but stand on principle and cancel any other shows you have there. This will probably hurt you more than them, but youve still got your pride and principles. You can then discretely put the word out to others what the deal is in that place.

This.

By the sounds of things, this bar has a reputation for cancelling bands on a whim. Cancelling a band just to feed your own ego is pretty sad. I'm not a club owner, but if I were putting together a benefit gig, for example, I wouldn't throw a band off the bill just to fit my band on there.

Worry not. In due time, this place's reputation will spread, and before they know it, they'll be scraping the bottom of the barrel with $125 a night bands and wondering why they can't get any pros to book with them.

[Flaw]

Rarely do we get a call about canceling. They just seem to "forget" to contact us.

A band i was in had the complete opposite happen to us. A band dropped a show on Aldo's a while back. Without asking if we could play they just put us down for playing. We found out about it by our other guitarist driving down past Aldo's and saw our name was up on the sign. We called to question it, and their reply was we forgot to call you.

[Banned]

Grrrr...

I received a phone call from someone at The Bunker today letting me know we have been bumped this Saturday because the owner's band decided to play this weekend (I won't mention names....) This is the second time this has happened! I know that it is not Melia's fault (she books the bands). Melia is a lovely person and works hard to establish good working relationships with bands. Considering that the owner is a musician, you would think he would be more considerate of other people's time and efforts!

Has anyone else had this experience?

Karma what goes round comes round. Take it from someone who know's. Put on your big girl panties. As a wise man once said shake off your shoes and move on......

[felix'apprentice]

i wouldn't worry bout it laura. you and dakota rose have enough talent to get you booked in many other venues.

love you guys!! see ya all soon!

rock on!

- kayla.

[Flaw]

im surprised no one made a drug response to this, doing a bump at the bunker...

[songsmith]

I was thinking someone would go for a reference to "bumped UP the bunker." Buggery is always funny to straight guys. --->JMS

[jeremy_kosmac]

sorry to hear about what happened Laura, but the guy w/ the contract idea is right. I played in Philly w/ Main Line Affair, and they always had contracts for gigs. At least 2 gigs, we got cancelled short notice and I still got a check. Keep in mind, however, if you're going to go that route (and try to enforce it legally) you're back to other issues like having the payroll on the books and taxes. So. . . it can be beneficial if you can make it work, but be prepared to run things as a normal legit business if you use contracts.

Jeremy

p.s. personally, I would try to book something in Windber (Stock's, Win.Hotel. . .etc) on the same date, just to draw away from his bar!

[UNEARTHA7XMatt]

Personally, every time Ive played at The Bunker it was great. The staff was great, the owner was great, and all the other bands were great. I have never once had a single problem with anyone at this establishment. So you got bumped! Does that mean you have to go on a forum and trash them? No I dont think so! That to me is just as bad as him bumping you. Seriously tho, this is kind of childish but oh well! Im not here to start fights and I probably should have kept my comment to myself but Im willing to defend this establishment because of how well we were treated there.

[Little Devil Girl]

She wasn't bashing the place, she was just asking a question. This is a forum for musicians to vent, talk, express whatever they are feeling.....

Maybe you have been fortunate enough to be in a band that has never been bumped, then good for you. It's not fair what the bar owners do, there are very limited places for the bands to play now and I truly believe at times the owners know this and play their little games...not fair to the men and women who put time, energy and money into their passion only to have a jackass take it away from them at the last minute.

I don't even know Laura, but I feel for bands when this happens.

[VENTGtr]

I didn't take the inital post as a trash at all. First, Laura posed a question, but it's
also a head's up. It's one thing when a bar or band cancels with legitimate issues.
The owner wanting to play that night is NOT a legitmate issue. It IS a warning sign.

There have been places on here in the past where warning signs have popped up.
It was generally a policy for me to give those places a CHANCE...but more often
than not, the signs should have been heeded.

When venue owners/managers. etc. run their place like their personal toy, or expect
bands to be their jukebox, or worse, karaoke machine, it's a badly run business and
at some point it'll likely come back to bite you.

It's also why both sides need to handle themselves professionally, responsibly, and
in a business-like way. Makes things easier, smoother, better AND more fun (For
those "I only do it for fun"-folks) for everyone.

We called to question it, and their reply was we forgot to call you.

That's darn funny.

[UNEARTHA7XMatt]

I should have stated which post I was talking about. I was not talking about the original post! It was the few that came after.

[DirtySanchez]

If I got bumped once, big deal. If it happened again, then yeah I'd be making it well known.

Oh and lol at that karma response. She must watch Carson Daly!

[bassist_25]

Im willing to defend this establishment because of how well we were treated there.

Is your experience representative of the majority of experiences of other musicians at the establishment? We've been treated really well by club owners who have bad reputations. Usually, it came down to the fact we made the club owner more money than the grieving bands. Sometimes, it comes down to whether or not you're in with a booking agent whose ass the owner is kissing. Regardless, as others said, a deal is a deal. If what the OP says is true (not saying she's a lying, but truth is in the middle and such), then it's good to know these things, as Dave pointed out. One grievance wouldn't scare me too much from booking a venue. When there seems to be a trend, then the spidey senses have to go off. There's a reason we never ever tried to book a gig at The Warehouse/Knight Bar.

[witchhunt]

There's a reason we never ever tried to book a gig at The Warehouse/Knight Bar.

Cause you're afraid you might have to hang out with me for a while.

[ToonaRockGuy]

There's a reason we never ever tried to book a gig at The Warehouse/Knight Bar.

Cause you're afraid you might have to hang out with me for a while.

Oh Bill, if he only knew...

[VENTGtr]

Ya know, I feel for these people:

I know that it is not Melia's fault (she books the bands). Melia is
a lovely person and works hard to establish good working relationships with bands.

Trying to do a good job, build a venue, and its rep, but having an owner who has
these whims, just needs to stay out of the way, etc. has to be nerve-grinding. Have
dealt with "bookers" who have to deal with this kind of thing. They're the ones who
have to make the canceling call, try to repair the damage, often deal with the fall-out
(Bands not wanting to book there because of the "shenanigans", and a CLEINTELE
who will start skipping the place altogether because they can't count on traveling there
and seeing who WAS supposed to be there.

Sincerely, the best of luck to her in overcoming the biggest problem she may have to
handle, the owner. It's like a built-in handicap at helping the place, and that same owner,
money.

Those people deserve more credit than they get and, unfortunately, often doesn't end
well.

The days where beer sells itself and people just like to be out are possibly gone. Venue
owners now have to be BUSINESS people and promote and handle their business....
businesslike....and a lot of them might be in a lot of trouble.

[bsaller]

Contracts kiddies! Verbal agreements mean nothing in today's struggling music market. It used to be as simple as a handshake and a verbal confirmation. Hell, contracts really mean nothing if you aren't going to take legal action. Put a 2-3 week cancellation clause in your contract. You have the right within that time frame and the venue also has the right within that time to cancel. Any sooner, then both parties can be held to contract terms financially.

Contracts? Hah! Good luck with that in this area...and is it really necessary? In addition, are those legal fees to take it to court worth the pittance you lost out on in the first place?

Most bands in the area do rely on a handshake and a verbal. Youre really only as good as your word around here in my honest opinion. Obviously, this guy is not good for his word.

You probably only have 3 choices:

1. Contact the owner (not the person who booked you) and have a civil, adult and business-like conversation explaining how his selfish decision cost you. And ask what is he prepared to do to make it right or whole. Be prepared for a negative or unsatisfactory result, but you may get a pleasant surprise.

2. Take the "screw me once, shame on you...screw me twice, shame on me approach" play the club again and take your chances.

3. This is the hard pill to swallow (especially for a band who just really wants to play some clubs and fill their calender), but stand on principle and cancel any other shows you have there. This will probably hurt you more than them, but youve still got your pride and principles. You can then discretely put the word out to others what the deal is in that place.

The whole situation sucks and Im sorry its happened. Its probably happened to all of us and we move on.

It is my understanding that if the fee for services rendered is less than $500.00 a verbal agreement and/ or handshake is legal in PA. Over $500.00 and you need a signed contract. Correct me if I'm wrong... Lonewolf, or anyone!

[lonewolf]

It is my understanding that if the fee for services rendered is less than $500.00 a verbal agreement and/ or handshake is legal in PA. Over $500.00 and you need a signed contract. Correct me if I'm wrong... Lonewolf, or anyone!

You are allowed to do whatever you want, but verbal contracts are only legally enforceable in amounts up to $500.