Count off?

Diavolo · Post by **Diavolo** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

I'm having a debate with another musician and need some experienced opinions.

When you (or your drummer) count off a tune, are you:
1) establishing BOTH the tempo and a starting point for the band OR,
2) choosing a starting point for the band and THEN make adjustments to the tempo once you're playing?

xero380 · Post by **xero380** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

I typically go for option # 1.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

Definitely option 1

tornandfrayed · Post by **tornandfrayed** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

#1 unless your just getting started. Or if you are really drunk...

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

#1

#2 doesn't do anybody much good unless everybody has their own different tempo

floodcitybrass · Post by **floodcitybrass** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

It should be #1

However, sometimes a tempo is so locked into the band that it doesnt matter what tempo the countoff is.

DirtySanchez · Post by **DirtySanchez** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

#1

But I like it when punk bands just do a normal 4 count then go apeshit fast immediately afterwards.

That's what I love about music. No rules.

daveb · Post by **daveb** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

Should be #1 fer sure.... The Stones always cracked me up though, with tempo and time signature 'adjustments' after the intro.

PStl · Post by **PStl** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

always #1.

if the tempo is incorrect, the rhythm section needs to interact and correct.

theoretically, you can judge the tempo by one motion, or 2 notes.

MeYatch · Post by **MeYatch** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

floodcitybrass wrote:It should be #1

However, sometimes a tempo is so locked into the band that it doesnt matter what tempo the countoff is.

this

I do think its pretty funny to count off extremely slow or extremely fast. Everyone has to have the tempo ingrained into them though.

UNEARTHA7XMatt · Post by **UNEARTHA7XMatt** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

I think its just to prove that Drummers can count to 4

VENTGtr · Post by **VENTGtr** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

#1. You're setting the tempo so everyone come in at the some one
rather than a bit of all-over-the-placeness till everyone gets it together.

A previous drummer didn't get this concept and for every song would be
a really fast click-click-click-click then he'd start the song. He thought it
was weird that he was expected to do that at the song's tempo. Took a
while to get that ingrained.

RobTheDrummer · Post by **RobTheDrummer** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

You set the tempo, but sometimes you have to adjust. Or different counts require subdivision because of a slow tempo or lead in. I think it's a resounding vote for #1 on this issue.

whitedevilone · Post by **whitedevilone** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

Number 1 sir.Then again we're idiots who pump the metrome through our PA at practice.Dorks.

floodcitybrass · Post by **floodcitybrass** » Tuesday Jul 14, 2009

RobTheDrummer wrote: Or different counts require subdivision because of a slow tempo or lead in.

Agree here.

I found it harder to count off slow songs than fast songs.
I have to say the "One and uh Two and uh" for 12/8 stuff otherwise I rush the count in.

sunsetbass · Post by **sunsetbass** » Wednesday Jul 15, 2009

homerski · Post by **homerski** » Sunday Jul 19, 2009

I know that this is about countoffs, but I think it also relates to tempo.

It is my experience that alot of bands (especially inexperienced or inept bands) tend to take songs too fast. It's almost like they are trying to hide their playing (in)ability behind the tempo. As if they are saying to themselves "let's try to hurry through these changes or riffs before anyone notices".

Want to really learn a song and make it tight?? Learn it at half speed or less. You'll quickly learn where all of the "holes" are. Then when you do finally play at full speed you'll be amazed!!

John (The Stick) Homerski, Jr.

dbdrummer89 · Post by **dbdrummer89** » Sunday Jul 19, 2009

Definitely #1, but that doesn't mean the whole song has to be the same tempo, as others said. As long as its premeditated that is.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Monday Jul 20, 2009

whitedevilone wrote:Number 1 sir.Then again we're idiots who pump the metrome through our PA at practice.Dorks.

That's awesome. I wish I could get my band to practice to a metronome... a lot of formally-trained drummers and pianists HAD to practice to a metronome. Every time one of my projects records, I try to get them to use a click-track, but alas, we never do. It tightens everything up SO much, and makes editing worlds easier, too.--->JMS

RobTheDrummer · Post by **RobTheDrummer** » Monday Jul 20, 2009

songsmith wrote:
whitedevilone wrote:Number 1 sir.Then again we're idiots who pump the metrome through our PA at practice.Dorks.
That's awesome. I wish I could get my band to practice to a metronome... a lot of formally-trained drummers and pianists HAD to practice to a metronome. Every time one of my projects records, I try to get them to use a click-track, but alas, we never do. It tightens everything up SO much, and makes editing worlds easier, too.--->JMS

Yea, metronomes can be your best friend. The trick is to use a metronome and not sound mechanical. Be able to play within the click. Maybe a little back or a bit on top of the click.

PanzerFaust · Post by **PanzerFaust** » Wednesday Jul 22, 2009

UNEARTHA7XMatt wrote:I think its just to prove that Drummers can count to 4

Don't be a dick.. everyone knows drummers can count to 4... It's 5 that gives them trouble.... Ba Dum Ta.....

Now to answer the question ... it's so drummers can make sure they got BOTH sticks in their hands before starting the song

Jones · Post by **Jones** » Thursday Jul 23, 2009

RobTheDrummer wrote:
songsmith wrote:
whitedevilone wrote:Number 1 sir.Then again we're idiots who pump the metrome through our PA at practice.Dorks.
That's awesome. I wish I could get my band to practice to a metronome... a lot of formally-trained drummers and pianists HAD to practice to a metronome. Every time one of my projects records, I try to get them to use a click-track, but alas, we never do. It tightens everything up SO much, and makes editing worlds easier, too.--->JMS
Yea, metronomes can be your best friend. The trick is to use a metronome and not sound mechanical. Be able to play within the click. Maybe a little back or a bit on top of the click.

It's amazing what a difference it makes for the entire band practicing with a metronome. Most bands tend to speed up or slow down during different sections and this will make you more aware of those spots. Not to mention tightening up the rhythm section.