for the kerry fans

bfoust · Post by **bfoust** » Friday Sep 17, 2004

hahaha, I haven't heard that..

and I don't like Cheney myself =)

byndrsn · Post by **byndrsn** » Friday Sep 17, 2004

stonekrow wrote:I so as a man maybe it's not my place to have a strong opinion on it unless I was put in the situation myself, afterall it is the womans body. Just my thoughts though I suppose. I couldn't imagine it being an easy decision.

What the fuck does it have to do with the womans body?!?!? Seriously!!

We are talking about a living being that is being murdered here!!

I am glad that Bobby Lee responded to my earlier post, but Bobby Lee - why didn't you respond to my true meaning?????

Bobby Lee, I will repeat my true meaning again:

At what point does someone get to decide to take the <i> "chance of freedom" </i> from the unborn?!?!?!?!?!?!?

If all that you say about freedom is true, than the unborn have a right to the same freedoms!!!!!!!!!!!!

Assault rifles don't kill people - People kill people!!
Car accidents kill people - but they are still accidents!!
If you really want to believe in what you say, then it is no different than if I were to want you dead and carried out that sentence. The only difference is that murder is illegal.. Right?

So, by your theory, if abortion were not legal - there would still be abortions, only the would-be-mothers would suffer - FUCK THEM!! By the same analogy - if murder was illegal, there would still be murders, but the victims would suffer ( OH wait - murder is illegal)!!!! DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA OF WHAT I AM GETTING AT??????

Yeah, Abortion is legal. Is it right?

Murder, rape and robery are not legal, but all of these things go on - so what. Never tell me that abortion will continue even if it is not legal in this country - that has no bearing on anything. Everything that is illegal continues to happen day after day. That does not make it right!!

esa · Post by **esa** » Saturday Sep 18, 2004

Totally right there Urbs. Bad things happen but we suck it up, get over it, and learn from the experience. Hopefully we grow from it as well. Abortion for a non life saving reason is just an easy out. Look at alot of people today. The slackers of tomorrow. Abortion is just another way to not take responsibility for your actions. Like mommy and daddy have to bail out their kids constantly since they do no wrong (don't anyone attack me on this...I work in a school. I grew up in this time period. when kids don't go to jail for robbery or heavy drugs so they can get counciling and cleaned up...they need help and no one will let them own up to their own actions. when they don't learn the meaning of work because mommy and daddy are paying for their cars and phones and everything.) There are enough profilactics (sp?) out there to prevent an unwanted/undesired pregnancy out there that abortion, unless it's one of those slim chances of life and death, should not be needed. What's that wives tale saying? "A stitch in time saves nine."

stonekrow wrote:It's a tough thing to decide, so as a man maybe it's not my place to have a strong opinion on it unless I was put in the situation myself, afterall it is the womans body. Just my thoughts though I suppose. I couldn't imagine it being an easy decision.

And Eric... that's just bullshit. Unless you're speaking of Mary and Christ, all births*** on this planet have happened because of the joining of a man and woman. I hate that I hate that I hate that. It's a womans choice! Bullshit! Guys have as much right over this kid as that woman does. But it's her body! Bullshit again! It's her body, but it's only half her kid. And if it's one thing I can't stand more than an abortion...is when a man WANTS to have something to do with this child and the woman does not want it. ::quiver:: I hate that. The man has no rights to his unborn child because it's inside a womans body. If she wants him/her scraped out of her stomach, he has no rights to stop it. I wish more people were like Jacklyn's birth mother. Adoption is a great thing! Gives a chance to people who can't have kids to have kids from the people that don't want kids. It's cool because those kids are *chosen* to be part of a family. Picked. Special. Out of a group.. and loved. Babies need love. All babies need love. Babies don't need saline solution. Babies don't need scraped. Babies don't need to be bagged and thrown out like unwanted garbage. I'm sorry if I'm upsetting any of you that had to have an abortion that was not your choice. But for those of you that think of abortion as a convenience, go watch one sometime. Let me know if you still feel the same way after you've seen one. I didn't. And I won't ever think that way again.

It's not a womans' choice. It's a baby.

***-I've read a few occasional medical oddities where a woman has both parts (testes and ovaries etc) and has impregnated her own self. Rare but I've read of two cases. Hell, my oldest cat's mother was a nuetured male. Yes, his mother was fixed..and male. He/She had both parts. And it will never be known for sure, but there is the chance that the kittens are his/hers completely. Brings new meaning to "I'm my own grandpa" don't it?

stonekrow · Post by **stonekrow** » Saturday Sep 18, 2004

Esa and birdbrainism

...................not even wasting my energy there, go re-read what I posted. Makes me sick to my stomach when someone has no idea what they're reading and they go and shoot their mouths off.

byndrsn · Post by **byndrsn** » Saturday Sep 18, 2004

stonekrow wrote:Esa and birdbrainism ...................not even wasting my energy there, go re-read what I posted. Makes me sick to my stomach when someone has no idea what they're reading and they go and shoot their mouths off.

My sentiments EXACTLY!!

stonekrow · Post by **stonekrow** » Saturday Sep 18, 2004

Good....

RobTheDrummer · Post by **RobTheDrummer** » Monday Sep 20, 2004

You know what I really don't understand about Kerry? He goes on shooting off about his Vietnam experience and he knows what war is, so he can lead through his experience....ok, but the war was 30 years ago. Is he saying that he hasn't learned anything about war since the Vietnam war, and that is even a war we lost!!!??? I mean the libs try to compare Iraq to the mess that Vietnam was, and you have Kerry trying to say the Vietnam war benefits his war policy? WE FREGGIN LOST VIETNAM...HOW WILL THAT HELP!!?? Anyway, as soon as you attack his war record, he goes back to Vietnam...as soon as you criticize his flip-flopping, all the sudden it's about can't a man change his mind? So what is he? Living 30 years in the past, or mind changer? Help me out!

esa · Post by **esa** » Monday Sep 20, 2004

stonekrow wrote:Esa and birdbrainism ...................not even wasting my energy there, go re-read what I posted. Makes me sick to my stomach when someone has no idea what they're reading and they go and shoot their mouths off.

Perhaps you should take your own advice there, Eric.

stonekrow · Post by **stonekrow** » Monday Sep 20, 2004

I'll be sure to do that Lisa.

By the way why are we using our real names on here now? Just curious.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Tuesday Sep 21, 2004

I mean the libs try to compare Iraq to the mess that Vietnam was, and you have Kerry trying to say the Vietnam war benefits his war policy?

There is no parallel between Vietnam and Iraq except that good Americans are getting killed. Americans are getting murdered at a lot higher rate right here in America. This Vietnam issue just illustrates that the DNC is unarmed in the arena of ideas and its lapdog press is desperate to get Kerry elected.

If CBS's recent gaff with the fraudulant memos isn't damning proof that the major media favors the democrat party, I don't know what is. They were very eager to use these documents, despite several expert warnings that they may be forgeries. That didn't matter, Kerry was behind in the polls and needed all the help he could get. What the left-wing controlled DNC just doesn't understand is that Vietnam is a DEAD ISSUE and the more they play it, the higher Bush's numbers go.

esa · Post by **esa** » Tuesday Sep 21, 2004

stonekrow wrote:I'll be sure to do that Lisa. By the way why are we using our real names on here now? Just curious.

I will use a name if I know the person and that person has stated who they are. You, for example, are using the picture I took of you for the album. You've stated your bands (past and present) and I believe you've used your name on a post or two. It's no secret who ya are. I use what people post by. Urbs is normal for me to say and so is tom (both are his names). so is bobby lee, so is apryl, so is jae, so is chad, so is jim.. yada yada yada. If you went by Erk, I'd call you Erk. If you prefer Stone Krow or whatever, please just tell me that. I prefer Esa, so I use Esa. Most of the others use either or. I don't care. Plus, there's a million other strings on this thread, just stating your name so you know it was directed at you and not at "birdbrainreason". ::pokes:: Untwist them there panties. We're friends, remember?

esa · Post by **esa** » Wednesday Sep 22, 2004

Honestly.. I think we should just nuke Afghanistan and Iraq nations... get it over with. Annex that part to the United States and start on the real problem. Canada, eh? They are just above us and they are way too damn quiet. Dontcha know. They've gotta be the master minds behind all this. They're trying to win us over with super groups like Rush...but you know those sneaky bastages are up to something a wee bit more e-vile...

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Wednesday Sep 22, 2004

esa wrote:Honestly.. I think we should just nuke Afghanistan and Iraq nations... get it over with.

100 megatons is enough to create a devastating effect on the biosphere. I really don't feel like living through a nuclear winter just because we don't like a country.

esa wrote: Annex that part to the United States and start on the real problem. Canada, eh? They are just above us and they are way too damn quiet. Dontcha know. They've gotta be the master minds behind all this. They're trying to win us over with super groups like Rush...but you know those sneaky bastages are up to something a wee bit more e-vile...

It's Geddy. He's the false prophet. Only the devil himself could kick so much booty at singing and playing bass.

But does that mean that Keith Richards is Jesus?

esa · Post by **esa** » Thursday Sep 23, 2004

bassist_25 wrote: It's Geddy. He's the false prophet. Only the devil himself could kick so much booty at singing and playing bass.

But does that mean that Keith Richards is Jesus?

I quiver at the thought...
At least that would be better than William Hung being the Savior...

stonekrow · Post by **stonekrow** » Thursday Sep 23, 2004

I found the following very interesting. Please wake up Bush supporters and stop supporting the rich mans war. Enjoy.

Dear Mr. Bush,

I am so confused. Where exactly do you stand on the issue of Iraq? You, your Dad, Rummy, Condi, Colin, and Wolfie -- you have all changed your minds so many times, I am out of breath just trying to keep up with you!

Which of these 10 positions that you, your family and your cabinet have taken over the years represents your CURRENT thinking:

1983-88: WE LOVE SADDAM. On December 19, 1983, Donald Rumsfeld was sent by your dad and Mr. Reagan to go and have a friendly meeting with Saddam Hussein, the dictator of Iraq. Rummy looked so happy in the picture. Just twelve days after this visit, Saddam gassed thousands of Iranian troops. Your dad and Rummy seemed pretty happy with the results because ‘The Donald R.’ went back to have another chummy hang-out with Saddam’s right-hand man, Tariq Aziz, just four months later. All of this resulted in the U.S. providing credits and loans to Iraq that enabled Saddam to buy billions of dollars worth of weapons and chemical agents. The Washington Post reported that your dad and Reagan let it be known to their Arab allies that the Reagan/Bush administration wanted Iraq to win its war with Iran and anyone who helped Saddam accomplish this was a friend of ours.

1990: WE HATE SADDAM. In 1990, when Saddam invaded Kuwait, your dad and his defense secretary, Dick Cheney, decided they didn't like Saddam anymore so they attacked Iraq and returned Kuwait to its rightful dictators.

1991: WE WANT SADDAM TO LIVE. After the war, your dad and Cheney and Colin Powell told the Shiites to rise up against Saddam and we would support them. So they rose up. But then we changed our minds. When the Shiites rose up against Saddam, the Bush inner circle changed its mind and decided NOT to help the Shiites. Thus, they were massacred by Saddam.

1998: WE WANT SADDAM TO DIE. In 1998, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz and others, as part of the Project for the New American Century, wrote an open letter to President Clinton insisting he invade and topple Saddam Hussein.

2000: WE DON'T BELIEVE IN WAR AND NATION BUILDING. Just three years later, during your debate with Al Gore in the 2000 election, when asked by the moderator Jim Lehrer where you stood when it came to using force for regime change, you turned out to be a downright pacifist:

“I--I would take the use of force very seriously. I would be guarded in my approach. I don't think we can be all things to all people in the world. I think we've got to be very careful when we commit our troops. The vice president [Al Gore] and I have a disagreement about the use of troops. He believes in nation building. I--I would be very careful about using our troops as nation builders. I believe the role of the military is to fight and win war and, therefore, prevent war from happening in the first place. And so I take my--I take my--my responsibility seriously.” --October 3, 2000

2001 (early): WE DON'T BELIEVE SADDAM IS A THREAT. When you took office in 2001, you sent your Secretary of State, Colin Powell, and your National Security Advisor, Condoleezza Rice, in front of the cameras to assure the American people they need not worry about Saddam Hussein. Here is what they said:

Powell: “We should constantly be reviewing our policies, constantly be looking at those sanctions to make sure that they have directed that purpose. That purpose is every bit as important now as it was 10 years ago when we began it. And frankly, they have worked. He has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors.” --February 24, 2001

Rice: “But in terms of Saddam Hussein being there, let's remember that his country is divided, in effect. He does not control the northern part of his country. We are able to keep arms from him. His military forces have not been rebuilt.” --July 29, 2001

2001 (late): WE BELIEVE SADDAM IS GOING TO KILL US! Just a few months later, in the hours and days after the 9/11 tragedy, you had no interest in going after Osama bin Laden. You wanted only to bomb Iraq and kill Saddam and you then told all of America we were under imminent threat because weapons of mass destruction were coming our way. You led the American people to believe that Saddam had something to do with Osama and 9/11. Without the UN's sanction, you broke international law and invaded Iraq.

2003: WE DON’T BELIEVE SADDAM IS GOING TO KILL US. After no WMDs were found, you changed your mind about why you said we needed to invade, coming up with a brand new after-the-fact reason -- we started this war so we could have regime change, liberate Iraq and give the Iraqis democracy!

2003: “MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!” Yes, everyone saw you say it -- in costume, no less!

2004: OOPS. MISSION NOT ACCOMPLISHED! Now you call the Iraq invasion a "catastrophic success." That's what you called it this month. Over a thousand U.S. soldiers have died, Iraq is in a state of total chaos where no one is safe, and you have no clue how to get us out of there.

Mr. Bush, please tell us -- when will you change your mind again?

I know you hate the words "flip" and "flop," so I won't use them both on you. In fact, I'll use just one: Flop. That is what you are. A huge, colossal flop. The war is a flop, your advisors and the "intelligence" they gave you is a flop, and now we are all a flop to the rest of the world. Flop. Flop. Flop.

And you have the audacity to criticize John Kerry with what you call the "many positions" he has taken on Iraq. By my count, he has taken only one: He believed you. That was his position. You told him and the rest of congress that Saddam had WMDs. So he -- and the vast majority of Americans, even those who didn't vote for you -- believed you. You see, Americans, like John Kerry, want to live in a country where they can believe their president.

That was the one, single position John Kerry took. He didn't support the war, he supported YOU. And YOU let him and this great country down. And that is why tens of millions can't wait to get to the polls on Election Day -- to remove a major, catastrophic flop from our dear, beloved White House -- to stop all the flipping you and your men have done, flipping us and the rest of the world off.

We can't take another minute of it.

Yours,

Michael Moore
mmflint@aol.com
www.michaelmoore.com

Punkinhead · Post by **Punkinhead** » Thursday Sep 23, 2004

Sweet Chocolate Christ will I be happy once this election is over with....

J/J all....I like to throw in random comments out of the blue....

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Thursday Sep 23, 2004

Guess what? Iran is next. Get used to it.

stonekrow · Post by **stonekrow** » Friday Sep 24, 2004

Yeah, I heard that also, Bush made an honest mistake, he meant IRAN, not IRAQ, that had the WMD. But ya know, there's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again. I think he'll get it right next time.

bfoust · Post by **bfoust** » Friday Sep 24, 2004

I should of guessed the author of that.. *sigh*

esa · Post by **esa** » Friday Sep 24, 2004

I still hold to my opinions that Michael Moore is a douche bag idiot. Never liked him or his work. Cocky s.o.b. Yes, I've seen his work. The man needs a vacation, a beer, and to get laid. Oh and to take that b.s. enima out of his anal retentive ass.

byndrsn · Post by **byndrsn** » Friday Sep 24, 2004

esa wrote:I still hold to my opinions that Michael Moore is a douche bag idiot. Never liked him or his work. Cocky s.o.b. Yes, I've seen his work. The man needs a vacation, a beer, and to get laid. Oh and to take that b.s. enima out of his anal retentive ass.

Yeah, exactly!!

I mean - come on people. Do you really expect us to even try to respond to any of the idiotic ramblings of Michael Moore? Seriously?

That is even so much worse then any conservative expecting a liberal to give the time of day to anything that Rush has to say - much much worse!!

(((Think about it)))

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Sunday Sep 26, 2004

stonekrow wrote:Yeah, I heard that also, Bush made an honest mistake, he meant IRAN, not IRAQ, that had the WMD. But ya know, there's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again. I think he'll get it right next time.

We not only knew that Saddam had WMDs, but we knew approximately how much he had left...after all, we gave them to him. Its not a matter of whether he had them, its a matter of what he did with them.

stonekrow · Post by **stonekrow** » Sunday Sep 26, 2004

Check this out, I knew it all along, it was these damn computers that caused this whole mess.

www.coxar.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/

byndrsn · Post by **byndrsn** » Friday Oct 01, 2004

Ya know, after last nights debate - I love this quote the best!!!! ((I think it is a quote from Chuck Muth, but I'm not sure - I just know that I love it!!))

We heard again and again last night exactly what John Kerry would do differently in handling Iraq and other hot spots around the world: Hold a summit. That was his answer to everything. What do they do at summits? Talk. Talk is what John Kerry does best. We saw that last night. But talk is also cheap. Clinton was full of it...in more ways than one. At some point, however, you have to put up or shut up. President Bush “put up” following September 11. If only John Kerry would now shut up.

killyourscene · Post by **killyourscene** » Friday Oct 01, 2004

it's disheartening when the truth means nothing and facts are viewed as propaganda. ignorance is absolutely bliss. if george bush can not admit when he is wrong, then he must be infallible and omnipotenet. it's only a matter of time before we nail him to a cross. how did we take the world's biggest sympathy after september of 2001 and turn america into the despised country that it is now? a derelict, war-hungry texan, that's how. we should have gained allies, not lost them. oh, we have england and poland, sorry. there was a right and wrong way to go into iraq. lies and impatience led the way to the complete chaos it's in now. when you all go to sleep tonight, pray to george w. bush that you don't live abroad. for fucksakes and the sake of our children, please wake up from your fantasy.