Fahrenheit 911 - The Temperature at which Freedom Burns

[coilman]

i was searching for info on my buddies in insideout when i came across this topic. there is a very interesting debate. imo, the left-right or the republicrat-demopublican debate is really a moot point because it sure seems that the agendas are the same, the only difference seems to be the route to the same destinations. it is election time once again, and once again the story is the same..... all of our problems are the other party's fault.

what doesn't make sense to me is that a majority of the people i know are straight ticket voters. whatever their party says that is what they believe. our union tells us to support the democrats because the republicans have never helped the steel industry. well bush imposed tariffs on illegally dumped foreign steel and promptly removed them when the wto said that the tariffs were illegal. clinton didn't lift a finger at all to help the steel industry( kinda like being stranded in the mojave desert for 5 days with no water, clinton walks by and gives you no water and later bush walks by and gives you a tablespoon full of water).

back to voting, people need to think for themselves. instead of voting for a politician because of what he says or because of his affiliation, start watching what he does. why do people think that just because a presidential candidate is neither a republicrat or a demopublican then he is not qualified to be president.

now some more questions. gary hart and john ashcroft have both stated that in order to be protected from future terrorist attacks, that we americans are gonna have to give up liberties and freedoms..... why? i am not willing to give up anything. i was in the first gulf war, and during my enlistment i was taught that we go to wars to fight FOR freedom, not to give freedoms away.

another thing that bugs me is, after watching the news channles all day on 9-11, is where was the 757 wreckage at the pentagon. there was nothing. when a passenger airliner crashes into a cornfield in iowa, the debris field spans for miles, the same for when a airliner crashes in a florida swamp. why not the pentagon? i worked around aircraft everyday during my enlistment and i fail to see how the pentagon swallowed a 757 whole.

i am not a political person, but there is a whole lot of stories that the government is putting out that just do not make any sense. if questiong the official government stories about 9-11 and the war makes me a bad american.....well then being bad feels good.

as far as voting... the independent party seems to be making the most sense this time around, but alot can change by november. i don't remember who said it, i think it was franklin roosevelt though, but the quote is this, "NOTHING in politics happens by accident." our rights are god given, it is the governments job to protect them. it is our duty as americans to keep a watchful eye on our government....of the people, by the people, for the people.

[bassist_25]

Oh no, a political thread has been resurrected. I just can't walk away; I have to post.

Coilman, I found your post to be very insightful. My grandfather was a steelworker, so I am always interested any information about the American steelworker.

I also agree with your thoughts about party affiliation. Personally, I would love to see a break down of the two major political parties. It's like choosing between Pepsi and Coke - they're slightly different, but yet you know that you want something that taste totally different. So you wind up buying a bottle of Jones Soda. Okay, that wasn't the post noetic analogy. I find that I identify most with the Libertarian and Natural Law (well, now it's the US Peace Government) parties. Though, I do have some major problems with a couple of the key points of the Libertarian platform, and believe that they will need to become more moderate if they wish to be a major political force in the future. For 3rd parties to become stronger contenders during elections, many things are going to have to happen. This includes banning soft money contributions, giving equal air time for all candidates, amending all laws that require petitions to allow 3rd party candidates on the ballot, and most importantly, people taking an active interest in politics so they are the ones controlling the destiny of the country and not special interest groups.

I also agree about losing our freedoms. I still don't understand why conservatives aren't fighting the Patriot Act. They're the ones who are suppose to be supporters of small government. I think it should be a prerequisite for high school civics classes to spend at least a chapter on North Korea. Why? Because North Korea is the perfect example of what happens when a government is granted to much absolute power without due process or checks and balances. North Korea is an exagerration since America would never become that much of an Orwellian nightmare, (and North Korea is literally an Orewellian nightmare) but it does give an archetype of what happens when people become complacent without being able to think for themselves.

[lonewolf]

I still don't understand why conservatives aren't fighting the Patriot Act.

As I had pointed out earlier in a very lengthy outline of the patriot act, it is a large piece of legislation and there are only a very few points about it that encroach on our freedoms. Specifically, it opens the floodgates for "probable cause" and that is not good at all. Most of the act is actually good legislation. I am hopeful that these few subparts are tested in the supreme court and found unconstitutional as they should be. I wouldn't expect any politicians to reneg on any part of the act during this year's political merry-go-round.