EMG 18v mod

JackANSI · Post by **JackANSI** » Sunday Sep 07, 2008

I know of a way. Not exactly as cheap as 2 - 9v, but it gets you 18 in roughly the same size.

I'll put pictures and details up tomorrow. I left my laptop with the pictures at work.

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Sunday Sep 07, 2008

Is it just a different battery configuration that equals 18v?

JackANSI · Post by **JackANSI** » Sunday Sep 07, 2008

yes 6 - 2450 coin cells. 80mah more life, same size as 1 - 9v. Configured as two stacks of three.

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Sunday Sep 07, 2008

Charltor wrote:
metalchurch wrote:
JackANSI wrote:It "evened" things out for me. Made the low strings clearer, made the high strings beefer. Makes getting it sounding good way easier.

But I guess I can sum it up like saying that it sounds like a thin film of plastic wrap was taken off the tone...
I know exactly what you are saying. That's why I said it feels more responsive and alive.
I associate the compressed feel with a muffled type of tone, and the extra 9v of power helps to combat the nature of the active system.

I'd definitely like to try this mod on my 7 string and see how it clears up the EMG 707's. The one problem is where to store the extra battery on a string thru w/o modifying the battery compartment??? Any ideas Joe? The control switch cavity maybe big enough, but it might cause unwanted noise storing the battery in there?

Dave,
I'm not sure how big the control cavities are on a Dean, but I just put both 9v's together wrapped them w/ black tape and laid them in the cavity.
I used some foam from the EMG box to keep them inplace and away from my volume pot.

And also I think you will notice a huge improvement with the 18v mod.
I did the mod to 2 of my Jacksons, one was tuned to Eb, and the other to C#.
The one in C# had the most notable difference in tone and clarity. It definitely helped clean it up and the noted now have more definition in them.
So it's safe to say that you will get the same effects in your guitar.

I still didnt wire up the toggle, but I'd like to so I can cut 9v's out of the loop and have my 'regular' 9v signal if I want it.

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Sunday Sep 07, 2008

JackANSI wrote:yes 6 - 2450 coin cells. 80mah more life, same size as 1 - 9v. Configured as two stacks of three.

Awesome, that's a damn good idea.
That would be cool to have a compartment routed with a round battery box to drop them in place.

old Skool · Post by **old Skool** » Monday Sep 08, 2008

You know I've been thinking about this mod for a while now and after your review Joe I'm going to try it. What you described tone wise is exactly what I'd like to get out of those EMGs. I always liked the clarity of EMGs but felt they lacked the dimension of a passive. Cool!

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Monday Sep 08, 2008

I knew about it for a long time, but I'm lazy when it comes to working on my own stuff, so I never did it til last week.

You'll love it, I'm tellin ya!
I just want to put a toggle to switch from 9 to 18, so I have both qualities.
(and I didnt put the toggle in yet either. I'm a piece of shit)

old Skool · Post by **old Skool** » Monday Sep 08, 2008

I've also read about this mod before but some guys said it really didn't make much difference. After reading your comments Joe I figured it's worth a try. Plus since you rock Jacksons if you say it's good, it's gotta be good ha, ha!

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Monday Sep 08, 2008

I also read that some ppl. said that they hear no difference, but it's prob 12-14 year old kids with low quality equipment or they are only going by 'what they read' on Harmony Central or wherever.

(edited for my bad spelling)
(pretty bad when I couldn't even figure out what I typed)

Killjingle · Post by **Killjingle** » Tuesday Sep 09, 2008

I think I might give it a shot too; but only because what u said about the sustain.

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Tuesday Sep 09, 2008

Killjingle wrote:I think I might give it a shot too; but only because what u said about the sustain.

I'm sure that you will hear the difference...atleast I hope

everyone's going by my description about it, so I hope I don't steer anyone wrong with this.
JackANSI, you've done this mod to your basses, did you notice anything different about the length of sustain?
I just want to reassure myself that I'm not crazy

I'm certain that there is a difference though. If not, it's not hard to reverse it if you don't hear any different.

JackANSI · Post by **JackANSI** » Tuesday Sep 09, 2008

I didn't notice any changes in sustain, but I have a hard time with that one by ear.

If you're feeding the guitar into tubes an increase in output levels could have the effect of a small increase in sustain, especially when the tubes are being over-driven. but its technically not really vibrational sustain.

No matter what the outcome, >= 14v is what EMG's were truly meant to run on.

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Tuesday Sep 09, 2008

JackANSI wrote:I didn't notice any changes in sustain, but I have a hard time with that one by ear.

If you're feeding the guitar into tubes an increase in output levels could have the effect of a small increase in sustain, especially when the tubes are being over-driven. but its technically not really vibrational sustain.

No matter what the outcome, >= 14v is what EMG's were truly meant to run on.

Yeah i know what you mean by that. My amp and set up is tubed and it is very transparent (if that's the word) and picks up any change I make to my guitars, whether it be pickup height, or those pole pieces that i was messing with a few weeks ago.
I know that I myself have noticed a difference, but others may not.

Kenny has a setup and has a similar sound to me so he should also hear it.
Chad has a different style and lower tuning, so it might be harder to pickup those changes, but he also has a noteworthy and quality rig himself, so then again he might just be able to hear the difference.

I didn't know they were meant for 14v, so then why are they able to run on 9v?
Did they mod them to run on a lower voltage like 9v because of the 9v battery being a common power source?

EMG stated that their systems can run on 27v but they don't recommend it.
It would be cool to have your guitar or bass's active pickups powered by a transformer that you could adjust the power from 9v up to 27v just to hear what changes there are @ each power level.

Could an adjustable 'universal' AC adapter sufficiently run an active system? I would think it could be made to work couldn't it??

I'd love to hear more about those stackable cell bateries when you have the time to explain it more, or better yet, show me a diagram on how you made the contact points for the + and - sides.

JackANSI · Post by **JackANSI** » Tuesday Sep 09, 2008

EMG originally designed their bass pickups to be phantom powered, but found unwanted distortions at those voltages. This was due to the not-so-great transistor/IC construction of the day. The linear regulators of those days would waste more current than phantom power can provide.

As long as you supply enough voltage for the transistors to operate you can run the ciruit. A 9v battery is a pretty small, cheap, easy to find source.

An ac adapter would work, but it would have to be exceptionally noise free. It would most likely parallel your signal lines. I have a switch mode regulator and balanced line driver I created for using phantom power with my one bass. The biggest problem with it was still noise. Even though the switching frequency was 97khz I could still hear a slight noise problem when using overdrive. I gave up on that out of frustration

JackANSI · Post by **JackANSI** » Wednesday Sep 10, 2008

Construction of that coin cell pack is simple. Just stack three on top of each other all with the + side up, wrap them "quarter roll" style with tape. Do the same to the other three. Then invert one of the stacks so you have one with the + sides up and one with - sides up. Put a few more turns of tape around that so that they are side by side.

Then put a paper clip on one +/- side, then line up your 9v connector on the other (remember this is reverse of the battery, the little nipple is - and the little flower is +). Tape these down.

As far as taping, do it as tight as you possibly can. Use electrical tape that is supple/rubbery, not the cheap stuff. Then once you have it all taped together, grab your wife/girlfriend's hair dryer and blast that thing up really close for about 30 seconds. This shrinks the tape slightly, tightens it more, and sets the adhesive better.

The 9v connector sticks out a little more than the battery is wide, so you can also use bare wire if you don't have room. On my other BBN5 I used a spare 9v connector I had laying around and put two big, but flat-ish blobs of solder on the wire ends to aid in contact. Remember that if you do it this way to put the black wire on + and the red wire on -, things are swiched around on this end.

Edit for after-thoughts:
Yes I know its sooo ghetto...

VENTGtr · Post by **VENTGtr** » Wednesday Sep 10, 2008

Somewhere, in the 17 mi. tunnel that is the LHC, this EXACT same
thing is running a whole bunch o' technology.

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Wednesday Sep 10, 2008

Awesome stuff there Jack, thanks for the pics.

does Radio Shack carry those cell batteries? I'd imagine they do, just wondering.
You say that this method has a longer battery life as opposed to a regular 9v?

I have plenty of room in my control cavity to put 2 of these together into an 18v version of what you posted cause I only have 1 volume pot and that's it.

JackANSI · Post by **JackANSI** » Wednesday Sep 10, 2008

Walmart even carries them, usually in the photo area.

Typical 9v is 800mah, these coin cells are 860mah. Plus EMG's get flaky around 7.5V at the supply thats only a 1.5v difference, the coin cells at 18v have 11.5v till then and 4v till that 14V area I spoke of.

I have yet to replace either of the 2 coin packs in my basses, and the oldest (2 years old now) still measures >=18V.

old Skool · Post by **old Skool** » Monday Sep 15, 2008

Did the mod this past weekend and wonder why I never tried it before. Derrr! The difference wasn't huge but made quite an improvement IMO. The bottom is warmer, more punch overall and the mid to upper range seems to be more "alive". The low E string (tuned to C# on this guitar) was always a little "flubbery" before. Now it's tight and warm. To me EMGs were always somewhat "flat" tonewise- no color, no flavor. The 18 volt mod with my setup gave them more of that passive dynamic vibe but very well balanced and clean. This has to be about the cheapest improvement to tone that I've ever tried. A five pack of 9 volt snap connectors was less that $3 plus the cost of the second battery. Joe thanks for the insight dude.

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Monday Sep 15, 2008

Kenny, I've done this mod to all 3 of my EMG equipped guitars, and the one that made me smile most was the one that I have tuned 1-1/2 steps down to C#.
The low end was loose and undefined, and I almost took the EMG out and put the Bill Lawrence back in, then I tried this 18v and that was it! Everything tightened up and it was there.

I'm glad that it worked out for you, and what reaffirms my thoughts are your descriptions about it feeling "alive" and more "tight".

Glad that you got similar results, that's awesome! I'm waiting for Chad's input on this when he gets done with his. I'm sure it will be similar.

I also could kick myself for not doing this long ago as well. Too bad it all can't be this cheap, right?

Killjingle · Post by **Killjingle** » Tuesday Sep 16, 2008

A five pack of 9 volt snap connectors

where do I get this?

Post by **Ron** » Tuesday Sep 16, 2008

Killjingle wrote:
A five pack of 9 volt snap connectors

where do I get this?

Radio Shack - $2.69 for 5
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index ... Id=2062218

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Tuesday Sep 16, 2008

Or you could cut one out of an old clock radio, or a stomp box. Pretty much anything that would have a 9v connection. That's where I got mine, cause I was cleaning house, and threw some alarm clocks etc. away.

old Skool · Post by **old Skool** » Tuesday Sep 16, 2008

I got mine at Radio Shack as Ron mentioned. Chad I have some extras. If you want to pm your address to me I'll gladly mail one to ya.

metalchurch · Post by **metalchurch** » Saturday Sep 27, 2008

I found this diagram that allows you to switch from 18v back to 9v without wiring or soldering.
It's quite simple actually, but this is only if you have a few 9v connectors lying around.
Personally, I'd rather just cut the wires and wrap some black tape on the wires and save the other connectors for something else.
I'm just posting this in case anyone would use it.