WTF does WTAJ have against Claudio?!?

[DrumAndDestroy]

Of course you guys don't have any problem with him - because he would never bone Bad Daze or Felix and the Canes - Hell No!! But, he has no problem giving it to anyone who isn't quite up those standards yet - and this is why I said that maybe what goes around comes around.

i don't know about that...for me personally at least. we played there a few times and claudio was great to us.

though everyone's experience differs.

[Hawk]

I'm really reluctant to throw my 2 cents in here because one, its just a different view point and Ill set myself up to be flamed and two, because I care a great deal for the local music scene.

I think its great you all are being vocal about your displeasure of how channel 10 is reporting this story and calling them out for it on a messageboard for this areas "general public".

Now, keyword here being "general public". Do you really want the general public coming over here to rockpage (now that there has been a link to it posted on wearecentralpa) to read some of the rediculous crap that gets posted on this board. Credibility is gone....caput....at the very least, greatly diminished.

The "general public" already thinks most musicians are drug-addicted, sex-crazed, dim-witted malcontents who really have nothing of importance to offer society as it is other than to "play that loud, obnoxious music". Or whatever, you get my drift.

I just hope you guys dont really expect to be taken seriously now if they take a peak around this little "musicians" forum we call home. Personally, its embarrassing to be lumped in with the "general publics" mindset of what a musician is. I encounter this all the time when I tell someone I just meet that I am also a "musician" and I see that look on their face.

Does it make you think about some of the things you and I post on here sometimes? It should when you want to be taken seriously during a serious time. You cant have it both ways.

This is really hard to articulate what Im trying to say. Its frustrating because I know there a lot of really good people on this board. But man Im tellin ya, if I came here for the first time and read even a small percentage of the posts here.....man oh man.

We are always in the spotlight...its the nature of our business.

So after going over to that other mesage board and being kinda proud some folks took a stand, and spoke politely I might add, only to see a link back to RP. My heart actually sank a little bit.

I know.....whaaaaaaaaa. Flame away. I can take it.

Well said.

Whenever I tell someone to check out Rockpage I explain to them that there are a lot of little kids who get on here and like to use bad language.

[Jacklyn Miauff]

Rob also posted on www.wearecentralpa.com. Go to Central Pa Chats and then his post is located under NEWS. Check it out there!!!!

LOL

Shouldn't have posted that! I went on, saw a response I had to argue, and then ended up writing a signature bassist_25 novel.

That's why I posted this. LOLOLOl I knew that all of you musicians would get the heat going for such a ridiculous report.

[Merge]

I was in aldo's friday night when the PLCB sent a minor in to try to buy beer. It was funny because the official "witness" was sitting beside me. When Rich threw the girl's license back at her and told her she could leave, the actual agent came in and told Rich that he didn't have to be so rude to the girl. Then he left, and shortly after the witness got up and left. Why is this not entrapment?

Entrapment is getting someone to do something that they wouldn't normally do, under normal circumstances. Say you're at a party and the cops show up. One of the cops ask you to move your car, you're blocking someone in, and when you do they arrest you for DWI. That's entrapment. A lot of bartenders don't pay much attention to ID's. I agree with everyone, it's like the media and the PLCB have nothing better to do. The liquor board in Allegany County, Md. is the same way. They get with the MSP and send in 18 and 19 year old State Police Cadets, all of them with fake ID's. They could make it harder, every State Police Cadet has a high and tight hair cut and I think the last time they did this only a few bars got busted.

[bassist_25]

As far as putting in time and being accepted - I can agree with what you are saying, and you guys and the Hurricanes (and others) have done that and I'm not trying to take anything away from you for that - because I truly commend you for it. At the same time, it is always those bands who stick up for these guys like Claudio. Of course you guys don't have any problem with him - because he would never bone Bad Daze or Felix and the Canes - Hell No!! But, he has no problem giving it to anyone who isn't quite up those standards yet - and this is why I said that maybe what goes around comes around.

Whoa, whoa, whoa! Tom, if you believe that we're somehow immune from being fucked over by a venue owner or promoter just because "We're Bad Daze," you are WAAAAAY off base. We have been dicked around by club owners who attempted to hand us door money when the original negotiation was for a flat rate and by owners who had habitual habits of cancelling us a week before a scheduled date just because they'd rather kiss some booking agent's ass by hiring one of his bands instead. It goes a lot deeper than just The Club Car not paying my band AT ALL. We just never publicized it when these things took place. I'm not saying this out of anger at all; I'm saying it to set the record straight. I can't speak for The Hurricanes, but I'm sure Bobby would agree with me that just because you've had some success doesn't mean that you are granted the red carpet wherever you go. We're not rockstars. We don't have a lawyer, and we don't submit ryders when we book a show.

Again, I'm not here to defend nor defame Claudio's character, because everyone's experience is different. For the record though, when I showed up at your gig, nobody hit me up for a cover. Not exactly what I'd want happening if I were playing for the door, but it's still different than paying a cover and then having the owner pocket it.

[heyhey]

I was in aldo's friday night when the PLCB sent a minor in to try to buy beer. It was funny because the official "witness" was sitting beside me. When Rich threw the girl's license back at her and told her she could leave, the actual agent came in and told Rich that he didn't have to be so rude to the girl. Then he left, and shortly after the witness got up and left. Why is this not entrapment?

Ultimately, it is indeed the establishment's responsibility to properly train the employees to screen customers but these PLCB set ups make it hard, especially if it's a busy night and they're using an illegal ID to try to get served. Personally, I think there are more productive ways the PLCB could spend their time, like by policing actual "nuisance bars" instead of trying to create new ones with the help of the television and print media. So they run bs like this but aomebody got stabbed at Uruah's on Saturday sent to the hospital to get staples and nobody heard a peep about that??? Sounds like bs! I like claudio have always had a great time and if he didn't think business first he probably wouldn't have one!

r:>)

[xero380]

I'm on Bad Daze and hurricanes side. Especially Bobby. When Fayted was together and we were playing over there regularly we've been dicked over before by Claudio but however....Claudio is an all around respectable guy who takes pride in his establishment and doesn't deserve to be bashed back and forth by the legal people and the local society just because a few bad "things" have happened there. Regardless in the end Claudio is Claudio and is still a good guy in my eyes. Yes he runs things his way but what do you expect? It's his bar, he knows the consequences of whatever he does, and if you can show him the green then maybe someday he will show you the red carpet?

[ToonaRockGuy]

Well, just to respond to the post that NightcrawlerSteve made regarding the link back to RP, I'm the one that put it there. And I'm not going to edit it. (No offense, Steve.)

I'm a musician.
I'm proud that I play.
I'm proud that I'm part of this community here on Rockpage.
I'm damn proud that we can and have done positive things in the community.
I'm real damn proud that kids look up to us and see us for what we really are.

I'm also real damn pissed that the majority of Altoids see us for what we are not.

I am a musician, and proud of it. And if I am smart enough to know that, then I really don't give a flying piece of cow shit what some 65 year old retiree thinks about my "devil music". But don't allow that one person to monopolize the majority by fear, ignorance, and incorrect assumption about live music.

Contrary to the popular Altoona stereotype of musicians, I do have a brain, I can hold a conversation utilizing words larger than "duh", I have a job, pay my taxes, and take care of my family, drug free.

I can also curse like a fucking sailor, scratch my balls in public, and act like an ass when I get drunk, just like everyone else in Altoona. We're all the same, no matter what the "politically correct conservatives" think.

Remember my favorite mantra...

"We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are." - Anais Nin

Let's work to make people in Altoona and Blair County see us for what we are, not for what they want or percieve us to be. Then, and only then, can they make their judgement.

Sorry for the mini-novel. I'm not approaching FutureBobby standards yet, but I'm working on it.

</soapbox>

[bassist_25]

Totally agree with everything you just said, Kevin. Some of the best people I've come across has been due to being a musician. I'm talking about people I consider friends for life. I remember every single person who has dicked me in this business and I remember every single person who has helped me out or treated me well. The later list is MUCH longer than the first.

And that post gets the Future Bobby Novel Seal of Approval.

[Naga]

Totally agree with everything you just said, Kevin. Some of the best people I've come across has been due to being a musician. I'm talking about people I consider friends for life. I remember every single person who has dicked me in this business and I remember every single person who has helped me out or treated me well. The later list is MUCH longer than the first.

And that post gets the Future Bobby Novel Seal of Approval.

Of course Paul. Being a musician is fun! It's good to find something to do, a good way to meet people,... Hell, good way in general to kick a convo off! I dunno how many people I've met over the years that we'd sit and start talking for hours, just over the words "So what do you play?"/"Do you play any instruments?"

[BDR]

First for Steve, I too hear what you’re saying ... BUT much like others who have already responded, it doesn’t bother me to think that people come here to lurk and check out what’s going on in our community. We’re people of all walks of life, we all have our own senses of humor, our own eccentricities, just like people in any other community, cyber or otherwise. And anything I say here, I would say in person, in jest or in all seriousness. The “me” on Rockpage is the “me” you get in person. So no, I am not embarassed if newbies come here; on the contrary, I want people to come here, even the “fuddie-duddies.” If people want to make snap judgements about us as a collective because we have a propensity for light-heartedness and tomfoolery (a word that old fuddie duddies will appreciate ... LOL), then so be it. These are not people I’m trying to impress.

Next, for byndrsn, for the record, after playing at City Limits/30 Something for several years now, we have just recently started to draw consistently in Altoona in general and at 30 Something specifically. There have been nights where Claudio’s staff outnumbered the people in the crowd — one night, we each took $9 (I took $8 that night because $35 doesn’t split evenly four ways unless you break it down into quarters). Sometimes (especially if you’re playing for the door), the math doesn’t work out in your favor and that’s when you have to make the decision: Is it worth it for us to play here? Are we committed to working for it or do we want instant reward? Altoona — not specifically City Limits/30 Something — is the toughest area around here that I’ve ever tried to work with any band. It takes time to build a rapport with the fickle fan base and there are a lot of entertainment options that you are up against on any given night. You say that it’s natural for bands like the ’Canes or bad daZe to stick up for Claudio because he would never “bone” us. As pointed out, and I can't speak for Felix and the crew, but we’ve left there in the past disappointed with the amount of money, but we accepted the fact that we didn’t deliver and made the decision to stick with it and continue to work for it, the eventual reward being a great room with lots of bodies in it and good money. It just seemed to me (and others) that you gave it one shot and instead of accepting that there’s work to be done in Toona Town for all new bands, you jumped ship on the place.

On the other hand, there have been venues where we've decided that it wasn't in our interest to invest the time for little or no cash and we shook hands and parted ways with those venues, no hard feelings. Never forget you're there first to help the club prosper.

I’ll quickly touch on witchhunt’s Club Car comment. There was a written agreement for a set fee, there was a PACKED house (ask JP for verificiation if you like), and there was no payment of any kind. We were challenged to sue them for the money. Also, as I understand it, the club even shirked on some of its advertising bills from that Halloween show, although I'll leave the advertising outlet nameless. Feel free to check out that thread from 2003 — four 1/2 years ago — and have a look at how many other bands were hosed by that place during the same time period. There were plenty who responded within the first several days of posting the thread. That situation was a little different than a band playing a place once, not drawing and then deciding to blast the club over a few dollars. Again, byndrsn, it’s up to you what importance you put in the amount you were paid that one night. I’ll belabor the point no longer.

To wrap, this thread is about the unfair targeting of a business by “the Dime.” Even if you hate Claudio, remember, WTAJ could be shooting video in front of your favorite club next.

r:>)

[nightcrawler_steve]

Kevin, I was not trying to point a finger at you for posting the link. I believe you when you say you are proud to be a musician, as am I. I wanted to clear that up with you because, even though we dont know each other well, I consider you a friend and a fellow drum brother.

Rob, it was awesome you called WTAJ on their story and I support and commend you for it. It also rocked so many people from RP went over and lent their support as well. Kudos all

My point was if we here on RP want to be taken seriously, why would you link it back to here. We are the only ones who "get" it or ourselves. To outsiders we probably do look like "Deveils Rejects who can type". I still stand by my opinion. Its just opinion, Im not trying to be the fun police or poo poo on this thread.

No comments on the flaming fuzzy? Im soooo bummed

**pouts, kicks a stone and sulks away**

[BDR]

Flaming fuzzy=rox.

My point was if we here on RP want to be taken seriously, why would you link it back to here. We are the only ones who "get" it or ourselves. To outsiders we probably do look like "Deveils Rejects who can type". I still stand by my opinion. Its just opinion, Im not trying to be the fun police or poo poo on this thread.

Again, I see your point, but I'm not going to alter my personality or hold back an opinion I feel strongly about to impress anyone or garner acceptance, nor do I expect anyone else here to do that. The world and every community in it has it's serious stuffed shirts, its village idiots and everyone else in between.

Also, I'm not going to refrain from having fun here, screwing around with my friends and colleagues, just so uptight people will think I have a brain.

r:>)

[bassist_25]

Made a post regarding the LCB and the problem that we have always had with them: The ambigious noise ordinance.