YankeeRose wrote:...The scientists, from Trinity College Dublin, have discovered that as many as one in 12 Irish men could be descended from Niall of the Nine Hostages, a 5th-century warlord who was head of the most powerful dynasty in ancient Ireland. His genetic legacy is almost as impressive as Genghis Khan,...
Yankee (and anyone else of these particular lineages),
As you and I have discussed before (albeit we were probably drunk at a hoedown), my paternal family are from the Hebrides, a small island chain that lies just west of Scotland and north & east of (what is today "Northern") Ireland. In the past the islands have served as a bridge between Ireland and Scotland and for a time even belonged to Norway. All three countries have contributed significantly to the genetic make-up of the islands (the Scots themselves having emigrated from Ireland). Since the time when Gaelic culture gained ascendency (roughly in the 13th century), most of the clan annals there have traced their progenation back to one ancient Gaelic hero or another. My particular clan (a branch of the MacDonalds) traces their lineage back to a figure named Somerled (roughly pronounced "Sorley" in Gaelic), who is estimated to be second to Gengis Khan in number of descendants (a far second). Somerled himself has traditionally been claimed as descendant of Colla Uais, who through genetic research is thought to have been a paternal line cousin to Niall of the nine hostages. Both Colla Uais and Niall are thought to have a common anscestor, who may or may not be the earlier Conn "of the hundred battles". There are remarkable genetic similarities between the MacDonalds, the O'Neills, and the O'Donnells. An interesting monkey wrench is thrown in when the DNA of known direct descendants of Somerled is analyzed. All these people show a Y chromosome that is distinctly Norse in origin. It's not really clear how this is congruent since all three families share certain strong Y chromosome characteristics.
songsmith wrote:Where would one find info on Gaelic geneaology? My family is Irish/Ulster Scot, McCarty on one side, and Stapleton on the other.---->JMS
Let me get some things together & then I'll PM you, as Gaelic genealogy can be terribly complicated (longer reliance on patromymics rather than hereditary surnames proper & such...) and would take the thread further off-topic. I love doing this kind of thing though, and will try to find some good stuff for you.
AllHolLowsEVe wrote:All this talk has made me want to go listen to "Behind Blue Eyes" by the Who. Maybe Townshend knew something we didn't back when he wrote that song!
RobTheDrummer wrote:So how do these scientists figure this shit out, do they have some kinda time machine that we don't know about?
Genetics and mitochondrial DNA. Its pretty amazing stuff actually. I took a few genetics courses in college and loved it. There really is something to be siad about the "bottleneck" theory. Usually, this occurs where populations were stressed and reduced in size by environmental forces or isolated from the main population. I did a special study in population genetics.
If you believe in creationism, then forget what I said. Insert head back in sand.
~S
Edited for spelling...ya know, since I mentioned college and stuff - ughh. Haha!
Last edited by nightcrawler_steve on Friday Feb 01, 2008, edited 1 time in total.
For all of you Darwinists. We all know that the dog comes from the domestication of the wolf, right. WRONG. Recent DNA tests show that the dog came from the (get this) THE DOG. Go figure. No DNA relation to the wolf.
Gallowglass wrote:Yankee (and anyone else of these particular lineages), As you and I have discussed before (albeit we were probably drunk at a hoedown), my paternal family are from the Hebrides, a small island chain that lies just west of Scotland and north & east of (what is today "Northern") Ireland. In the past the islands have served as a bridge between Ireland and Scotland and for a time even belonged to Norway. All three countries have contributed significantly to the genetic make-up of the islands (the Scots themselves having emigrated from Ireland). Since the time when Gaelic culture gained ascendency (roughly in the 13th century), most of the clan annals there have traced their progenation back to one ancient Gaelic hero or another. My particular clan (a branch of the MacDonalds) traces their lineage back to a figure named Somerled (roughly pronounced "Sorley" in Gaelic), who is estimated to be second to Gengis Khan in number of descendants (a far second). Somerled himself has traditionally been claimed as descendant of Colla Uais, who through genetic research is thought to have been a paternal line cousin to Niall of the nine hostages. Both Colla Uais and Niall are thought to have a common anscestor, who may or may not be the earlier Conn "of the hundred battles". There are remarkable genetic similarities between the MacDonalds, the O'Neills, and the O'Donnells. An interesting monkey wrench is thrown in when the DNA of known direct descendants of Somerled is analyzed. All these people show a Y chromosome that is distinctly Norse in origin. It's not really clear how this is congruent since all three families share certain strong Y chromosome characteristics.
Anyway, Howdy cuz!
Way cool! I do believe you're correct about the inebriated (or fatigued) state at Hoedowns, and I recall some of the ancestral familial interactions. Being cousins is a LOT better. HowDY!
Some years ago, before Al Gore invented the internet, I sent away for a surname scroll and mine is indeed Norse in origin. However, I have way more info. on the maternal side of my Dad's family. I did find my paternal Great Grandfather's name, D.O.B. and "Naturalized Citizen" via a WWI draft registry record I found online, and I know he sailed to the U.S. from Glasgow and a few other minor things, but that's it. I need to make a trip to Pittsburgh and search through records to learn his parents' names one of these days. (I've been lazily and apathetically saying that for 10 years or so. )
Hawk wrote:For all of you Darwinists. We all know that the dog comes from the domestication of the wolf, right. WRONG. Recent DNA tests show that the dog came from the (get this) THE DOG. Go figure. No DNA relation to the wolf.
If you step back and think about it, wolves and dogs can interbreed. If there were no common ancestry, this wouldn't be possible.
Hawk wrote:For all of you Darwinists. We all know that the dog comes from the domestication of the wolf, right. WRONG. Recent DNA tests show that the dog came from the (get this) THE DOG. Go figure. No DNA relation to the wolf.
If you step back and think about it, wolves and dogs can interbreed. If there were no common ancestry, this wouldn't be possible.
Well Ron Mules and Horses can also breed but they make Asses of Themselves. LOL
Hawk wrote:For all of you Darwinists. We all know that the dog comes from the domestication of the wolf, right. WRONG. Recent DNA tests show that the dog came from the (get this) THE DOG. Go figure. No DNA relation to the wolf.
If you step back and think about it, wolves and dogs can interbreed. If there were no common ancestry, this wouldn't be possible.
Well Ron Mules and Horses can also breed but they make Asses of Themselves. LOL
Mules are all sterile. Donkey + Horse = Mule. Take the time to know your asses.
I sent away for a surname scroll and mine is indeed Norse in origin. However, I have way more info. on the maternal side of my Dad's family. I did find my paternal Great Grandfather's name, D.O.B. and "Naturalized Citizen" via a WWI draft registry record I found online, and I know he sailed to the U.S. from Glasgow and a few other minor things, but that's it. I need to make a trip to Pittsburgh and search through records to learn his parents' names one of these days. (I've been lazily and apathetically saying that for 10 years or so. 
) 
