9/11 documentary

[Hawk]

Rob. It's a (proven) fact that the war has made the USA so unpopular that the number of potential terrorists has INCREASED. That's from the CIA.

If you go in to a war for no reason , and our beloved men and woman have to die, then they died for no reason ! It's the biggest shame any President has ever brought to our military. Die for me because I feel like starting a war. Bush is an idiot.

[Hawk]

Either that, or your whole family gets killed by a terrorist attack on the states. These boys die for us, and you feel that you should just pull out and make the ones that did sacrifice themselves do so for no reason? They volunteer to do this, what don't you understand? I could see if we forced someone to do this. War is war, I just wish they didn't handcuff the troops and let them kill before they get killed. You people have no spine, that's why we are going to lose the war on the muslim fanatics. A hell of a lot more than 4,000 troops are going to die.

If you think that the war is stopping terrorism in the US then you are a fool. There is no way to stop someone who wants to walk into a mall with a bomb strapped to their back.

The 4000 dead already died for nothing. Why don't you get that. Iraq had nothing to do with 9 /11 !

Why should another 10,000 die for nothing.

In twenty years the war will not end, so after 20,000 more deaths we should come home , huh ? I mean WHEN ?

We're keeping the fight over there. We aren't stopping terrorism right now, but we are bringing them out of the clockwork. 4000 did not die for nothing, you of all people should be proud of the work they are doing over there. When have we been attacked last? If we just pull out of Iraq, we're gonna end up there in a few years anyway, also, terrorists will take over and have the oil and money on top of it. I say we stick it out and win this thing, give Iraq their new government that can control who comes in and out and lead to a more peaceful state than before.

By the way, the world right now is more peaceful than it's been in years.

Rob. In the next thirty years you will not bring the Sunnis and the Shiites together. So by saying "Let's stay until we win, by staying until they have a stable government", means we will be there forever @ 1000 US deaths per year. You and Bush do think alike.

[Hawk]

Rob, we both want the same thing. A safe USA. We can agree on that.

I just think if we had used our resources to go after the people who actually caused 9/11 instead of getting bogged down in Iraq indefinitely, we'd be better off.

And I believe we should refocus our efforts to that end.

[Hawk]

Our military is now stretched so thin that it is weaker than it has ever been. That scares the hell out of me.

[DirtySanchez]

Blow'em all the fuck up and make Iraq the 51st state.

Stupid fucks haven't figured it out since biblical times.
We're not gonna teach them anything, they like war.
It's reached a point where they don't give a fuck anymore.
It's a joke, we're over there playing cop, waiting for shit to happen.
Be proactive and blow them the fuck up.
We need to play some offense.

[RobTheDrummer]

Our military is now stretched so thin that it is weaker than it has ever been. That scares the hell out of me.

Who's fault is that? (WJC!)

It's not only Bush's fault man. Congress voted to go in there, and as soon as we lose a few troops and elections are coming up, all the liberals have a hissy and turn on the war, leaving Bush in there to finish the damn thing. We got attacked on 9-11 without being provoked. We've been keeping America safe since. 0 attacks in 6 years. That's pretty good since Clinton had more than that on his watch and did nothing about it. Even let Bin Laden go when he had the chance to take him. Where do you get your news? You watch CNN? Well CNN is the liberal media outlet. If you don't believe that, then you are missing the whole other side of all stories. I tend to look at both sides and figure out what is right.

[RobTheDrummer]

Oh and Bill, what do we do when we pull out and Iraq becomes a complete mess. That's when people will hate us for not helping them and turning our backs on them. That's when Al-Qaida becomes stronger with a save haven. They will have oil to get money to buy weapons. Great plan you got there. All because you think we lost already.

[Hawk]

Oh and Bill, what do we do when we pull out and Iraq becomes a complete mess. That's when people will hate us for not helping them and turning our backs on them. That's when Al-Qaida becomes stronger with a save haven. They will have oil to get money to buy weapons. Great plan you got there. All because you think we lost already.

You or Bush haven't explained how you can win a civil war between two religious groups. Genocide is the only way, and moral people are against genocide. Since the war will never end, how many Americans do you want to die before you learn you can't settle THEIR civil war ?

You cleverly avoided many of my questions. I'll wait until you answer .

BTW. General Petreaus' facts (nearly all of them ) have already been shown to be lies.

And I found out exactly what his boss, Admiral Fallon said about General Petreaus. "Petreaus is a kiss ass chicken shit" !

Don't forget, the White House wrote the Petreaus speech before he got here. Another fact. So technically I guess he's not a lier, he just followed orders and said what he was told to say. A good little soldier that.

[metalchurch]

Hawk, do you have a big vein protruding from your neck when you type these passages? I'm picturing that for some reason.
Just kiddin' man trying to lighten the mood.

[Hawk]

Hawk, do you have a big vein protruding from your neck when you type these passages? I'm picturing that for some reason.
Just kiddin' man trying to lighten the mood.

No, not at all. I'm thankful for a forum and a free country. Rob and I are the best of friends and we would most definitely stand up for each other in any given situation ! I respect his opinion and he respects mine. But we both enjoy a little verbal jousting.

Mostly I have a smile on my face when I read some of the posts. I like to make people think. They don't have to agree with me at all. But if they're thinking for themselves and making up their own mind (like Rob) I have a great respect for that !

The most annoying thing for me is the people who pay no attention to what's going on because they are not being directly affected.

bfoust cracked me up when I read he'll be taking his Xbox to Iraq.

[RobTheDrummer]

Hey Bill, we had a civil war once. Now we all live together and are able to live in peace with one another believing whatever they want. If we can get that to happen over there, that would be awesome. However there are certain groups that don't want that. That's what we are fighting for. You think it will never happen, that's a negative view my friend. I understand they have been fighting for years, we need to get them to quit brainwashing children into strapping bombs on themselves. To do that, you have to take out the ones who are leading that way of life.

Oh, and I love Bill like a father, so don't go thinking me and Bill hate each other.

[metalchurch]

I didn't think think you guys hated each other, but I must say at times (especially at 2am when I get up for work) when I read these they seem extremely heated. It's like Point and Counter Point.
Nothing wrong at all with a little friendly debate. It's real cool that you guys keep your composure during all of this.
I admit, I do not follow the war at all. I didn't from the beginning and in order for me to fully understand it in it's entirety, I feel that I would have alot of reading up to do, and I'm not even sure who to side with at this point. There's alot of great points on both sides, but nothing in the immediate future that would really solve anything.
Oh well, I know nothing, I'm not even gonna get in to this.
Rock on guys.

I guess I am one that annoys you then? lol

[Hawk]

I didn't think think you guys hated each other, but I must say at times (especially at 2am when I get up for work) when I read these they seem extremely heated. It's like Point and Counter Point.
Nothing wrong at all with a little friendly debate. It's real cool that you guys keep your composure during all of this.
I admit, I do not follow the war at all. I didn't from the beginning and in order for me to fully understand it in it's entirety, I feel that I would have alot of reading up to do, and I'm not even sure who to side with at this point. There's alot of great points on both sides, but nothing in the immediate future that would really solve anything.
Oh well, I know nothing, I'm not even gonna get in to this.
Rock on guys.

I guess I am one that annoys you then? lol

lol........BUT..........you are thinking !

I have to add, that all of you make me think too, and I thank you for that !

[Hawk]

Hey Bill, we had a civil war once. Now we all live together and are able to live in peace with one another believing whatever they want. If we can get that to happen over there, that would be awesome. However there are certain groups that don't want that. That's what we are fighting for. You think it will never happen, that's a negative view my friend. I understand they have been fighting for years, we need to get them to quit brainwashing children into strapping bombs on themselves. To do that, you have to take out the ones who are leading that way of life.

Oh, and I love Bill like a father, so don't go thinking me and Bill hate each other.

Rob.........love you like a son ! Of course we both already know that

A religious civil war that's been going on for hundreds of years can't be in any way, compared to our USA civil war. They DO believe in genocide, and they believe that genocide is their answer to peace. "Death to the infidels" is not a slogan, it is a way of life !

[RobTheDrummer]

Hey Bill, we had a civil war once. Now we all live together and are able to live in peace with one another believing whatever they want. If we can get that to happen over there, that would be awesome. However there are certain groups that don't want that. That's what we are fighting for. You think it will never happen, that's a negative view my friend. I understand they have been fighting for years, we need to get them to quit brainwashing children into strapping bombs on themselves. To do that, you have to take out the ones who are leading that way of life.

Oh, and I love Bill like a father, so don't go thinking me and Bill hate each other.

Rob.........love you like a son ! Of course we both already know that

A religious civil war that's been going on for hundreds of years can't be in any way, compared to our USA civil war. They DO believe in genocide, and they believe that genocide is their answer to peace. "Death to the infidels" is not a slogan, it is a way of life !

OR how about "death to america" being chanted by Iranians being led by Ahdmenijhad? What do you suppose we do about him? He sends Iranians in to fight us in Iraq.

[Hawk]

So, if we stay there. In the midst of a civil war. And Iran continues to send insurgence. You're OK with staying another 50 + years at 1000 American deaths and 6500 casualties each year ?

Explain what scenario you see happening by staying there ?

Even if we stay until they have a government. When we do leave the civil war chaos will increase. And they will still hate us.

If we leave with a two year plan. When we do leave the civil war chaos will increase. And the will still hate us.

I think the scenario will be the same no matter when we leave.

[nakedtwister]

So, if we stay there. In the midst of a civil war. And Iran continues to send insurgence. You're OK with staying another 50 + years at 1000 American deaths and 6500 casualties each year ?

Explain what scenario you see happening by staying there ?

Even if we stay until they have a government. When we do leave the civil war chaos will increase. And they will still hate us.

If we leave with a two year plan. When we do leave the civil war chaos will increase. And the will still hate us.

I think the scenario will be the same no matter when we leave.

Bill, I agree that this war sucks and too many Americans are dieing. Any human dieing is a shame. Even the sick bastards who started this shit . It's a shame that their hatred is fuel by a friggin' book. But We are all to blame. I know that Bush is the Forrest Gump of Presidents but I believe his heart is with America and in the beginning we all cried for revenge. To say that Iraq had nothing to do with this is nuts. They asked for our help to bring civility to their country and when we intervene they piss down our throats and call us the bad guys. I also agree that we will never change their ways. For thousands of years they have been fighting the Holy War and they will continue to do so, but I would much rather see their country destroyed rather than mine. I enjoy waking up to a neighborhood that isn't littered with rubble. Other than from the neighbor kids. I do respect your views and consider you an intelligent person and a friend but my views are set on this one. When my nephew says that we need to be there I have to believe him. He has seen the every day occurances there and it's not pretty. I guess there is no one answer to it all. Brian E

[Hawk]

So, if we stay there. In the midst of a civil war. And Iran continues to send insurgence. You're OK with staying another 50 + years at 1000 American deaths and 6500 casualties each year ?

Explain what scenario you see happening by staying there ?

Even if we stay until they have a government. When we do leave the civil war chaos will increase. And they will still hate us.

If we leave with a two year plan. When we do leave the civil war chaos will increase. And the will still hate us.

I think the scenario will be the same no matter when we leave.

Bill, I agree that this war sucks and too many Americans are dieing. Any human dieing is a shame. Even the sick bastards who started this shit . It's a shame that their hatred is fuel by a friggin' book. But We are all to blame. I know that Bush is the Forrest Gump of Presidents but I believe his heart is with America and in the beginning we all cried for revenge. To say that Iraq had nothing to do with this is nuts. They asked for our help to bring civility to their country and when we intervene they piss down our throats and call us the bad guys. I also agree that we will never change their ways. For thousands of years they have been fighting the Holy War and they will continue to do so, but I would much rather see their country destroyed rather than mine. I enjoy waking up to a neighborhood that isn't littered with rubble. Other than from the neighbor kids. I do respect your views and consider you an intelligent person and a friend but my views are set on this one. When my nephew says that we need to be there I have to believe him. He has seen the every day occurances there and it's not pretty. I guess there is no one answer to it all. Brian E

I don't remember Iraq asking for our help. But that's not the point I want to make here. As others have said, what's done is done. We have to solve things from where we are now.

Brian, I respect your opinion as well. And I feel too we are good friends. We all want the same thing, we just disagree on how to solve the problem.

Why is it that politicians set up the scenario that if you don't think like I do, you are my enemy. I like to think I can disagree with a friend, no matter how vehemently, and remain a friend. That's what a free America is all about. I think it was a shame (and people bought into it) that G.W. set out to make everyone who disagreed with him as unpatriotic, UnAmerican.

I think people SHOULD vote, but I also think they SHOULD know what they are voting for. In other words, being informed about government actions and subsequent consequences, is more important for voters today than ever before !

[RobTheDrummer]

I don't think Bush set out to make anyone look unpatriotic or unamerican...the liberals do that to themselves.

[ToonaRockGuy]

I'm just posting this because it's a political conversation, I've been waiting to use it, and I think this is funny. But, I think there is some truth to it...

[bassist_25]

LMAO, that's great, Kevin.

[bassist_25]

I don't think Bush set out to make anyone look unpatriotic or unamerican...the liberals do that to themselves.

I also don't think that Bush set out to make anyone look unpatriotic. He left that job up to Karl Rove and all of the talk radio spin doctors.

[Hawk]

I don't think Bush set out to make anyone look unpatriotic or unamerican...the liberals do that to themselves.

I also don't think that Bush set out to make anyone look unpatriotic. He left that job up to Karl Rove and all of the talk radio spin doctors.

With his blessing. He could have stopped that if he wanted to.

Old news, but I don't remember anyone but me supporting the Dixi Chicks. I mean, come on, Stations like Froggy banned them for speaking their mind !

That was the mentality at the time. You can say what you want as long as you agree with the President. If you disagree you are not patriotic ! YOU WILL BE BANNED AND PUNNISHED !

Freedom of expression was denied to the Chicks while our military was fighting for freedom of expression ! Ironic, isn't it ?

BTW 66% of the USA is now unpatriotic.

[nakedtwister]

Freedom of expression was denied to the Chicks while our military was fighting for freedom of expression ! Ironic, isn't it ?

BTW 66% of the USA is now unpatriotic.

Thats kinda pushing it Bill. No one denied the Dixie Chicks freedom of expression they just instituted their right not to play their music. If I recall their faces were splashed all over the TV and they got the publicity they wanted. If anything it boosted their careers with more fans of the non- Bushites. So it didn't hurt them one bit. They were sitting stagnant at that point untill they released that song ( I'm Not Ready... ? ).

[Banned]

I don't think Bush set out to make anyone look unpatriotic or unamerican...the liberals do that to themselves.

I also don't think that Bush set out to make anyone look unpatriotic. He left that job up to Karl Rove and all of the talk radio spin doctors.

With his blessing. He could have stopped that if he wanted to.

Old news, but I don't remember anyone but me supporting the Dixi Chicks. I mean, come on, Stations like Froggy banned them for speaking their mind !

That was the mentality at the time. You can say what you want as long as you agree with the President. If you disagree you are not patriotic ! YOU WILL BE BANNED AND PUNNISHED !

Freedom of expression was denied to the Chicks while our military was fighting for freedom of expression ! Ironic, isn't it ?

BTW 66% of the USA is now unpatriotic.

What Constitutional right do the Dixie chickadees have that all radio stations have to play their music? Do they have their own Bill of Rights?

Any private radio (not government run yet) has the right to play or not to play any music they want for whatever reason.

Hawk, when your arguments sound so silly, it makes it hard to agree with the few points you do actually make.