Warwick Bass or Carvin Bass, such a hard choice!

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Saturday Oct 15, 2011

I been wanting to get a new bass guitar because I finally joined praise team at my church and am playing bass in it. So, I stopped at Rainbow Music today and was looking at a Warwick. Now I don't know whether I should get one of those or a Carvin. What would you all get?

I like them both. They look, play and sound sweet. Plus the price isn't bad. If you wouldn't go with either one of those two, which one would you go with?

hicksjd9 · Post by **hicksjd9** » Saturday Oct 15, 2011

WARWICK!

grimmbass · Post by **grimmbass** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

The new sub-$1000 Warwicks are utter garbage. The instruments that used to be their Chinese-made "Rockbass" line are now being sold as "real" Warwicks. The finish work is appalling and the quality of the wood is equivalent to a Squier. If you want a Warwick of any quality, be prepared to spend at least $1500 (and these ones are made in Korea now...you can't touch a German-made Warwick for under $2000).

Best import under $300: Squier Vintage Modified Series
Best import under $500: Schecter Stilletto, Ibanez SR, Peavey Grind
Best import under $1000: G&L Tribute Series L2000, Ibanez BTB
Best bargains under $1500: Carvin, Music Man, G&L USA Models

Carvin basses are top notch instruments (just ask Paul from Bad Daze) and, if you go easy on options, you can have a real-wood, USA-made bass for less than many imports.

Choosing an instrument is a subjective thing....these are just my two cents!

KT

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

Thanks for the input, Kent. That really helped.

Geetarzz · Post by **Geetarzz** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

Buy something pre owned and double your budget.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

I'm not sure yet if Squier makes a "Classic Vibe" bass, but the Tele's and Strats are excellent, judging by the ones at the Emporium. The 60's-inspired Tele is so resonant and plucky, and the vintage finishes really add to the instrument. I play bluegrass, but I'm SO tempted to get one. I'll look into the Classic Vibe basses.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

Apparently, they only have one bass in that line, an early-50's P-Bass copy (the style with the Tele headstock and the single-coil p-up). I did not realize they have PINE bodies. If I'd known that prior to playing the Tele, I might not have even tried it, but I have to admit, I liked it alot. Back in the day, you built guitars out of the heaviest, densest wood you could find, so it still amazes me that basswood and other light woods are so popular.

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

I was looking at some squires online, Johnny. They looked pretty nice. Not a bad price either. I will have to take a closer look at them. I am surprised with how popular basswood is as well. Then I guess a lot of it has to do with weight. I can imagine that a couple of them ones you speak of were quite heavy.

This quire, for example, looks like a good one: Only thing I don't like is that there are no dots on the fretboard. it has good reviews, though.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/bass/squ ... tring-bass

moxham123 · Post by **moxham123** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

I have never played a Warwick or Carvin to give a proper evaluation but some of my friends who have Carvins rave about them.

I own an original Steinberger and a 4001 Rickenbacker and love both of them.

I recently made a trek to Pianos 'N' Stuff and Guitar Center and played a few basses.

All the under $500 Ibanez basses sounded awful
The $800 Schecter sounded and played great
The Epiphone violin (Hofner style) short scale sounded okay but felt awkward
I played a few others but can't remember exactly what they were because they were not worth remembering. I did not play any bass that excited me that I would want to spend money on.

A while back, I played a foreign made Fender Jaguar bass at Music Haven in Johnstown (about $800) that was really nice and sounded terrific that I would not mind having.

I understand the Music Man basses are very good also

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

Thanks for the input, Duaine, it helps. I played a couple of carvins over the years, my church has one now that they are borrowing. I love them. They are great guitars. I am pretty much just seeing what else is out there before I decide on one. There are so many to choose from, it makes your head spin at times.

hicksjd9 · Post by **hicksjd9** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

You can get Active German made Warwick Corvette Standards on Ebay for 5-600 all day long. They are a beautiful instrument, certainly as nice if not nicer than my Ernie Ball stingray at much lower cost. I've had both Corvette versions, didn't like the ash. Loved the one with more exotic wood (can't remember the name of it right now). Used market is your friend, in this day and age, I would never buy new, you will lose half your money the minute you walk out the door.

My personal favorite basses are Musicman/Ernie Ball Stingrays. They just seem to be able to get almost any sound with that active pickup. You can find them for about 800 used (if you are a little lucky). You certainly wouldn't be disappointed with one of them, but if for some reason you were, people would be chomping at the bit to buy it from you. They're solidly built and are so nice to play when set up properly.

I'm not as famliar with Carvins and you have to special order them, so it's hard to judge what they sound like until you get one in your hands (which you can't until you buy). I'd go listen to Paul play and see if that is the sound you are going for. His rig (the carvin) sounds great, so I can't imagine that you would be unhappy with a carvin.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

Geetarzz wrote:Buy something pre owned and double your budget.

This. I would probably never buy a brand new Warwick considering how many of them are prevalent on the used market (and a brand new BO Thumb is still over $2k); and Carvins take such a hit on the used market, you can find them at killer prices on Ebay and Talkbass.

Really the question of Carvin vs. Warwick comes down to taste, so as long - as my bass brother Kent pointed out - you're buying a German-made Warwick. The Rockbass stuff never impressed me and I'd personally rather go with an Ibanez or Schecter if I were buying a bass at that price point.

Warwicks are like Rics, though. They have a feel and sound that is all their own. They're all aggressive sounding, much like a Spector, but with more "wood" to their timbre...if that makes any sense. The basic line Corvettes are passive basses, but most of their other lines are active. The Dolphin is the company's Cadillac. I've never owned a Warwick, but I came close to buying one on multiple occasions. I'll still probably eventually own one, because I've always loved them. If you're doing contemporary Christian praise music (e.g., Kirk Franklin), a Warwick may suit you very well. If you're doing more traditional praise music or Southern gospel, the Warwick will still sound great, but there may be better instruments to sit in the mix.

Carvin's are on a whole a bit more "polite" sounding. Although the company offers a few different pickup selections, they generally have a more refined sound with a smooth midrange and a clear top-end. The necks, for the most part, remind me of a slightly wider Jazz neck. The Bunny Brunel and SB models come standard with wider necks. The exception to all of this is my Icon. It has a bit of a more chunky neck - still very comfortable, though. And it's actually a very Warwick-like bass - very aggressive and burpy with a lot of wood in the timbre. I think it's due to all of the Walnut in it.

Frank, I'm at 30 Something on Saturday and will have at least two of my Carvins with me if you want to come check them out.

P.s. I have the Squier Deluxe Jazz pictured above and it's a really cool bass as well.

grimmbass · Post by **grimmbass** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

I agree completely on the "used" philosopy, and you can pick up used Carvin basses for a song!

I have to also agree with Paul, tone is a very subjective thing. I have never found Warwicks to be particularly aggressive-sounding, but to be more "dark". Truthfully, that's what has prompted me to put my Warwick Streamer up for sale; give me a CR Spector over a Warwick any day.

I also have to respectfully disagree about the MusicMan vs. Warwick quality; I've never played a Music man that didn't equal the German Warwick stuff, and i think they're simply better (and cleaner) sounding basses. With two p'ups and three switches, my G&L L2000 can ape anything from an ultra-treble jazz tone to a burpy neck p-bass sound. It truly was Leo Fender's ultimate evolution of the electric bass.

Geddy Lee plays a jazz bass. So does Marcus Miller. And Reggie Hamilton. Steve Harris plays a P-bass. And about a million other players use bolt-on Fenders. Basic, fundamental tools. You don't need a big expensive instrument to sound great!

Truth be told, much of the price that goes into making expensive instruments is "gingerbread"; expensive quilt/flame tops, exotic (and often complex) complex electronics, and grandiose hardware. Ultimately, a player's tone is ultimately the way a magnet picks up the vibration of metal strings over magnets and resonated through wood. Even cheap wood can sound good!

But, then again, it's all subjective! Play the bass and see if its mojo calls to you!

hicksjd9 · Post by **hicksjd9** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

Interesting. I didn't realize anyone said Musicman's were below the quality of a Warwick. I'd have to respectfully disagree with whomever said that as well. They are second to none in my book. I've had a pile of REALLY nice basses through my studio and have owned nice specimens of pretty much all the major brands now, but the Ernie ball is the one I have kept. BUT out of all the ones I have sold, I miss the Warwick the most. Like Paul said, it's a bit of a one trick pony, but man, that trick is good--especially for rock. There is a really cool shootout of a music man and a warwick on youtube. You should do a quick search. They are both super nice, but they give you two very different sounds (and the Ernie Ball gives you WAY more sonic options).

Not sure if the Warwick (growl) would be a nice fit for a church bass, though. You will get much more tonal versatility out of the other basses mentioned here, but if you are looking for an inexpensive bass that is very high quality, used Warwick Corvette Standards are your gold standard. I will be hard to touch anything else as nice at anywhere near that price. I've seen the German made 4 string ash ones with active pickups go for $400 locally (and I bought mine for very close to that). That said, if you have the extra cash, go Music Man.

I agree that G&Ls are really nice, too. They remind me quite a bit of the Music Man basses (probably because Leo designed them both post Fender). They record nicely.

Listen to the bass experts on here. I just record bass guitars and I've played a lot of them so I have a fair idea of how each of them sound--that's as far as it goes for me. Paul and Kent have an intimate understanding of their basses and they are professional bassists as far as I'm concerned. You can't go wrong by doing exactly what they say. They only thing I would add to the discussion is that my personal opinion of Warwick corvettes (german) is that they are awesome and you could not possibly go wrong grabbing up an older corvette standard (Active).

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

Thanks for the offer, Paul. I will be in Indiana on Saturday but will try to stop by. I am using a Carvin now, as my church is borrowing it. It is a lb70, active, I believe. It is a nice bass, only thing is that it is fretless. So the learning curve of it is quite different. I also played quite a few of them over the years. Which is why I am concidering one.

I want to get a good active fretted five string. I was reading talkbass forums here the other day, and most of the people in the HUGE praise team thread say that a five string is the best type to use with it.

My main decision point will also be what would fit right in a church setting. So I don't want anything that is dark, or cryptic, if you know what I mean. That is why I am looking at the regular strat style, or jazz style, type basses and not the over the top designs.

Thanks a lot for all the insight, everyone. Your thoughts are really helpful. So far I looked at earnie balls, schectors, carvins, fenders, squires, ibanez, warwick, G&L, Peavey, and some others I can't remember the names for. It is a hard decision.

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Sunday Oct 16, 2011

There are so many nice ones out there. My mind keeps saying carvin, but I don't want to jump on the first one I see. I need a nice sounding, church setting, clean looking bass that won't break my wallet. I'm not going to spend a couple of thousand on one right now. I just want to get one that will work well for my setting and go from there. I will look on ebay to see what I can come up with.

bassist_25 · Post by **bassist_25** » Thursday Oct 20, 2011

grimmbass wrote: Truth be told, much of the price that goes into making expensive instruments is "gingerbread"; expensive quilt/flame tops, exotic (and often complex) complex electronics, and grandiose hardware. Ultimately, a player's tone is ultimately the way a magnet picks up the vibration of metal strings over magnets and resonated through wood. Even cheap wood can sound good!

I definitely have to agree. In my experience, you need to reach a certain price point to get what I'd call a "professional level" bass - that is, a bass with a clear, strong fundamental and sustain, good fretwork, clean electronics, good finish, and professional tone quality. IME, that price point - on the brand new market - is, give or take, around $1200. After that, the law of diminishing returns kicks in, and you're paying exceptionally more for a much smaller increase in objective quality.

Speaking of complex electronics, I remember BassNW had an Alembic on its used page for some time that had something like 15 knobs on it. It even had an XLR jack in addition to the standard 1/4" jack. My rule of thumb is that my bass's onboard electronics shouldn't have more knobs and switches on it than my bass channel on the mixing board. *lol*

MOONDOGGY · Post by **MOONDOGGY** » Thursday Oct 20, 2011

I would avoid Warwick. I've had three of them (all upper end models) and was fairly disappointed with each of them. I'd compare them to a tele guitar, meaning you gotta tweak the crap out of it and have the perfect touch to get great tones out of it. You gotta work for great tone on a Warwick! And the necks have the profile of a Louisville Slugger- not comfortable. (Warwick fans, don't rip me a new one. This is just my experience!)

I've also had a few Carvins, all LBs. They are the most bang for the buck. There's no arguing that the prices for new and used Carvins are awesome considering they're nicely built, quality sounding, US made custom instruments.

I have to put in a suggestion for Spector. (Kent, shame on your for forgetting! I know you're on a G&L kick, but man, c'mon!!!) For praise and worship type music, a Spector may be a bit aggressive tone-wise, but there's nothing like a Spector. Please avoid any of the Korean models. Stick w/ Euro ReBop models and up!

I recently acquired a MM Stringray 5. THESE ARE GREAT BASSES!!! This bass can simply do it all. It'll be great for praise and worship. It's got an amazing rock tone. And it'll pull off slap 'n pop style funk all night.

Laklands are also a great bass for what you're looking for, even the Asian made Skylines.

Lastly, I'll add a +1 for a Squier if you're on a budget. My father had a Pete Wentz signature P, and after playing it for 5 minutes, I HAD to buy one of my own. For a $150 bass (used), this thing ROCKS! This model only has a volume control, so I had to add a cap and a tone control cuz I'm a tweaker. But man, does it sound good. It can do the vintage FAT P tone, a Steve Harris Iron Maiden rock tone, and a great funk tone. I've played a lot of other Squiers that all fit this bill.

I'm sure a lot of the other makes out there would suffice for what you're looking for, but they could all be hit or miss as well. I'll get ripped apart for this one too, but Ibanez, Dean, Schecter, LTD, and similar brands are all just that- similar. Many of them are even made in the same factories, have the same components, feel the same, and sound the same. I've only played maybe a handful of basses from these manufacturers that impressed me as far as tone, versatility, construction, feel, and overall quality.

The best way to figure out what bass to choose is to play as many different makes and models as you can get your hands on. Visit guitar stores and play friends basses to form your own opinions. And keep us posted on what you decide on. (Since I got married, I now have to get my 'new bass high' by living through others!) Good luck.

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Thursday Oct 20, 2011

Thanks a lot for the great response, Moondoggy. I am trying out as many as I can before I get one. I am on a little bit of a budget. So price and quality is what I am looking at.

I am looking at the used market, and also looking at the new market. I am sure I will find something.

I am thinking about making a trip to guitar center in either Monroeville or Harrisburg to see what they have. And check some out.