Feds Raid Gibson Guitar

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Monday Aug 29, 2011

There is no proof that Gibson did anything wrong. Until I hear otherwise, I am taking Gibson's side.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Monday Aug 29, 2011

Okay, you can do that. How does the gov't profit from busting Gibson, what's in it for them? Before you reply with some ideological reason, like the gov't hates business, think. How does busting Gibson help anyone, if they haven't done anything wrong? What benefit comes from attacking a popular business for no reason. Who gets paid from that? Not gov't. Now, ask the opposite: would Gibson benefit from obtaining illegal wood and making pretty guitars out of it before anyone notices, for say, five-grand more than the guitar would be worth without it? So what I'm asking is, if you could buy unicorn-horn for a few hundred dollars, and sell it for a few thousand, would it be possible that someone actually did just that?
For the record, ivory was once widely used on musical instruments, as was tortoise-shell. They've been illegal for decades, and music still somehow gets made. I like looking at pretty guitars, too, but I'll be honest with everyone: I've never paid more than $400 for a musical instrument. Why?
I don't need to.

Banned · Post by **Banned** » Monday Aug 29, 2011

Rosewood and ebony fret boards are there for sound quality, not for pretty looks. Why does govt do this shit, because they can, and no one can stop them. Why do hundreds of different government agencies permit their agents to carry weapons? Cause they can. Its called authoritarianism.

Why did armed swat teams raid a raw/natural food store? Fascism.

whitedevilone · Post by **whitedevilone** » Monday Aug 29, 2011

$400 guitars are most likely shit.Play away.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Tuesday Aug 30, 2011

whitedevilone wrote:$400 guitars are most likely shit.Play away.

Go ahead and roll your eyes. I'm doing just peachy.

I can throw down with a thrift-shop guitar and a $10 harp. A carpenter needs a suitable hammer, it doesn't need to be laser-guided and jade-handled. The most valuable guitar on Earth isn't valuable because it's pretty. It's valuable because Hendrix played it.
So spend too much, and play away.

onegunguitar · Post by **onegunguitar** » Tuesday Aug 30, 2011

The Great Oz has spoken

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Tuesday Aug 30, 2011

Who's The Great Oz?

RobTheDrummer · Post by **RobTheDrummer** » Friday Sep 02, 2011

Here's a quote from an interview with the CEO...

"CHRIS DANIEL: Mr. Juszkiewicz, did an agent of the US government suggest to you that your problems would go away if you used Madagascar labor instead of American labor?

HENRY JUSZKIEWICZ: They actually wrote that in a pleading.

CHRIS DANIEL: Excuse me?

HENRY JUSKIEWICZ: They actually wrote that it a pleading.

CHRIS DANIEL: That your problems would go away if you used Madagascar labor instead of our labor?

HENRY JUSKIEWICZ: Yes"

There's your answer Johnny, the government does want to take American Jobs....confusing eh? Welcome to liberalism my friend!!!

After all of this, Obama wants to talk to America about his "job" plan....I wish someone in the media would call his ass out, just once catch him off guard and see what the hell he can say about it....

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Friday Sep 02, 2011

Thanks Rob. Like I said: The government is just upset because they didn't move the whole operation out of the country.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Saturday Sep 03, 2011

Wingnut Andrew Breitbart is reporting that Martin dimed them out. Martin is a competitor of Gibson's.
If so, this is one corporation pulling dirty crap on another, using existing laws. If the Feds didn't move on Gibson, you'd all be calling it favoritism, and blaming Obama directly.
Now, is American business the Wild West, or not? Should there be rules to encourage fair competition, or should there be one final guitar-maker, the big fish who ate all the others? I mean, legally, I can't call what I play a "dobro," because Gibson bought that trademark and destroyed it with inferior foreign product, and now enforces it legally.
Should Martin use the gov't to hurt their competitor's, is that what the free market's all about? And how the hell does this fall on Obama's, or the gov't's shoulders, for enforcing EXISTING law, should they just allow laws to be broken? Would you bawl-baby about this if Gibson dimed Martin out? Would you mind if China bought all the hard rock maple and used it in their "guitars?" Or do some of you just mindlessly react, like you're told to? Hmmmm.

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Saturday Sep 03, 2011

If it is true, and Martin did do that. Then it is not cool. You don't do that to another company!

RobTheDrummer · Post by **RobTheDrummer** » Saturday Sep 03, 2011

What's fucked up, is the way they raided the place. Did they have to have guns and a kick down the door mentality? For christ sake, it's a fucking musical instrument factory. Send in an inspector with a warrant to check things out. I guess they thought there would be some dudes in there with guns protecting their "illegal" wood.

Taken from WSJ:

"Federal agents first raided Gibson factories in November 2009 and were back again Aug. 24, seizing guitars, wood and electronic records. Gene Nix, a wood product engineer at Gibson, was questioned by agents after the first raid and told he could face five years in jail.

"Can you imagine a federal agent saying, 'You're going to jail for five years' and what you do is sort wood in the factory?" said Mr. Juszkiewicz, recounting the incident. "I think that's way over the top." Gibson employees, he said, are being "treated like drug criminals.""

Banned · Post by **Banned** » Saturday Sep 03, 2011

A government Nazi is going to defend this corrupt, authoritarian, fascist government, no matter what you say.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Sunday Sep 04, 2011

Who's a government Nazi?

RobTheDrummer · Post by **RobTheDrummer** » Sunday Sep 04, 2011

songsmith wrote:Who's a government Nazi?

There's a difference between who a government Nazi is, and who someone tells you who a government Nazi is.

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Sunday Sep 04, 2011

RobTheDrummer wrote:
songsmith wrote:Who's a government Nazi?
There's a difference between who a government Nazi is, and who someone tells you who a government Nazi is.

That is true. And it isn't the tea party, Johnny

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Sunday Sep 04, 2011

The Nazi's WISH they had a propaganda machine like the Tea Party. Other parallels: strong nationalism, isolationism, racial/religious discrimination, class warfare, self-involvement, strong entitlement to authority, I could go on, but unlike the hard right, I don't have a psychological need for argumentum-ad-Hitlerum comparisons. I don't have to justify my own ignorance by pointing out that someone was once more ignorant.

Banned · Post by **Banned** » Sunday Sep 04, 2011

songsmith wrote:Who's a government Nazi?

One who defends and enables a fascist government. Blick in den spiegel.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Sunday Sep 04, 2011

Isn't it funny how any government action that goes against the grain of a populist libby progressive is SS stormtrooper action, but when it encroaches on some toes with a different viewpoint from theirs, the libbies are first to don the jackboots.

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Sunday Sep 04, 2011

songsmith wrote: Other parallels: strong nationalism, isolationism, racial/religious discrimination, class warfare, self-involvement, strong entitlement to authority.

Man dude, you just discribed the left there. Wow.

f.sciarrillo · Post by **f.sciarrillo** » Sunday Sep 04, 2011

lonewolf wrote:Isn't it funny how any government action that goes against the grain of a populist libby progressive is SS stormtrooper action, but when it encroaches on some toes with a different viewpoint from theirs, the libbies are first to don the jackboots.

They are having identity issues. As well as not being able to look in the mirror.

songsmith · Post by **songsmith** » Monday Sep 05, 2011

lonewolf wrote:Isn't it funny how any government action that goes against the grain of a populist libby progressive is SS stormtrooper action, but when it encroaches on some toes with a different viewpoint from theirs, the libbies are first to don the jackboots.

That's alot of words to say "rubber/glue." I'd have gotten crucified for that, but that's the essense of modern conservatism, a short memory for one's own criticisms.

Merge · Post by **Merge** » Monday Sep 05, 2011

I have a question: how is turning this country into a banana republic/nanny state "progressive"?? That doesn't seem like progress to me.

whitedevilone · Post by **whitedevilone** » Tuesday Sep 06, 2011

Think i'll keep my Gibsons.

lonewolf · Post by **lonewolf** » Wednesday Sep 07, 2011

songsmith wrote:
lonewolf wrote:Isn't it funny how any government action that goes against the grain of a populist libby progressive is SS stormtrooper action, but when it encroaches on some toes with a different viewpoint from theirs, the libbies are first to don the jackboots.
That's alot of words to say "rubber/glue." I'd have gotten crucified for that, but that's the essense of modern conservatism, a short memory for one's own criticisms.

In case you haven't noticed, i'm an equal opportunity critic. To me, just about anything the government does anymore is police action. Meanwhile, both the left and right quarrel over their pet issues that shouldn't even have a place at the federal table.

And yes, I'm going to keep my Gibson, but since I sold the Starcaster, I am Fender-free for the 1st time in my adult life.